One Pistol or Small Side Arm

[Whiterook]

Given the choice between something that "could", "might", "may" do the job and something that WILL do the job, I'm gonna put the odds in my favor.
And no, I wouldn't want to be shot with a .22 (or a .380, .25, or BB) any more than I'd want somebody to attack me with a $50.00 BudK wallhanger sword-like-object.
Still not gonna bet my life on either one of them though.

NOTHING is 100%.

Sure, take the 9mm, 45, whatever. I will too, when you run out of ammo in a day or two you'll wish you would have taken a .22 as well. That is all I'm saying.

I'll say it again, because not one person seems to understand this. The .22LR will not do everything. But for someone to completely disregard it is just fool hardy. It offers so much utility in many different categories. It is one of the Survivalists favorite round.

Also, nowhere did I say not to shoot? Don't know where you got that from.

One thing I would like to add. The environment you are in will make a big difference. I live near mountains that I know well, as do my friends. The .22LR can be very effective in that environment with rocks, boulders, trees, gullies, etc all there for defense and cover.

Again, it does not do everything so it won't be the only thing my group has. But it will be there.

I'm offering a pretty reasonable argument here and you guys dismiss this round as if it is useless. It is pretty shocking.

Be well-rounded folks, you'll get farther in life.

EDIT- Trumble...a semi-auto .22 rifle with detachable magazine is ideal. There is no gas system on .22 rifles(at least I don't know of any). The Ruger 10/22 being a good example, hi-cap good quality mags are readily available. I'm ordering a few 30 rounds soon made by Tactical Innovations, they are good stuff. 75 rounds tear drop magazines can also be had but they are more expensive. The semi-auto pistols are also a good choice such as a Buckmark or Ruger.

[mattifikation]

Uhmmm... The title of the thread is "one gun."

And if you shoot me with a .22 you better be prepared to beat me off of you with the butt of the gun...

[Whiterook]

Uhmmm... The title of the thread is "one gun."

And if you shoot me with a .22 you better be prepared to beat me off of you with the butt of the gun...



First statement is true, but it kind of devolved into the usefulness of a .22LR.

Second statement is just laughable.

[Trumble0]

Also, nowhere did I say not to shoot? Don't know where you got that from..

That wasn't directed at you personally, it is Max Brooks Suggestion to either not shoot or use a silencer I believe, so Brooks kind of contradicts himself by telling you to carry laods of ammo and not shoot


EDIT- Trumble...a semi-auto .22 rifle with detachable magazine is ideal. There is no gas system on .22 rifles(at least I don't know of any). The Ruger 10/22 being a good example, hi-cap good quality mags are readily available. I'm ordering a few 30 rounds soon made by Tactical Innovations, they are good stuff. 75 rounds tear drop magazines can also be had but they are more expensive. The semi-auto pistols are also a good choice such as a Buckmark or Ruger.

The reason they're semi-automatic is because they use some of the Gas/explosion however you want to word it that is created when the primer is touched off; to cycle in the next round. I believe the term is blowback system, I wasnt correct in saying gas system, like AR-type rifles. But they aren't as powerful as bolt actions or anything you cycle manually because in those firearms all the power is harnessed for propulsion of the bullet down range. I own a 10/22 they're a nice gun, I've had very few problems with it infact the only problems I've had were with spring tension in the cheap 3rd party rotary box magazines. I'm not saying the .22 is completely useless, But it's not going to be my main weapon, or the only weapon I carry, it has it's uses and strong points but I dont think the taking down of man-sized creatures is one of them, I could see having a break down "survival rifle" for hunting squirrels and such when you're scavenging.
My brother has a Buckmark but he bought it for hunting squirrels and plinking, when he goes out he still carries his .45 as a self defense gun.

[Whiterook]

With a .22, or anything, you don't lose much speed with a semi-automatic. Not enough to matter, where did you hear that you lose enough to make it significantly weaker?

[Trumble0]

With a .22, or anything, you don't lose much speed with a semi-automatic. Not enough to matter, where did you hear that you lose enough to make it significantly weaker?

It just makes sense, If not all the power is used for propulsion it will equate to a weaker round, I'm not sure how much weaker, and I'm not sure there would be a standard reading. I'm sure it would vary depending on rifle design and the type of ammo you use. I for one use cheap .22 thunderbolt ammo which is so shitty it gives different velocities in the same gun depending on the round. I've never had an FTF with my bolt action .22, but with my 10/22 it can be picky I'm not sure if it's the mag spring or if the occasional weak round prevents the blow back system from working. Not like I need to buy match grade ammuntion though, Im not a Competitor. I'm not trying to say the .22 is worthless, it is probably the #1 selling varmint caliber of all time, and if a .22 is all you have then I guess it's what youd be using in a ZPAW. But I personally would go for something bigger despite the advantages of zero recoil, and the ability to carry tons of rounds. I don't belive a .22 is a toy like some people, but Im accustomed to shooting large caliber rifles so that would be my first choice in rifles, and I enjoy shooting shotguns, I don't own very many small caliber rifles with the exception of my MKII and my 10/22 and I have fired a .17 HMR.

But yes, I feel you should carry what you are comfortable with, and if I have come off as dismissive to the .22 round and your suggestion, I apologize.

[Tripoli]

Someone on this board did a test on a pigs head with a .22. Went deep into the brain, there was a video on Youtube of it. I'll try and find the post.

That poster was rabidly pro-.22 to the point of being a huge pest. I argue for it, but I know it can't do everything.

http://www.youtube.com/user/nightstalkerbob


I found it.... and it is good!

[Whiterook]

It just makes sense, If not all the power is used for propulsion it will equate to a weaker round, I'm not sure how much weaker, and I'm not sure there would be a standard reading. I'm sure it would vary depending on rifle design and the type of ammo you use. I for one use cheap .22 thunderbolt ammo which is so shitty it gives different velocities in the same gun depending on the round. I've never had an FTF with my bolt action .22, but with my 10/22 it can be picky I'm not sure if it's the mag spring or if the occasional weak round prevents the blow back system from working. Not like I need to buy match grade ammuntion though, Im not a Competitor. I'm not trying to say the .22 is worthless, it is probably the #1 selling varmint caliber of all time, and if a .22 is all you have then I guess it's what youd be using in a ZPAW. But I personally would go for something bigger despite the advantages of zero recoil, and the ability to carry tons of rounds. I don't belive a .22 is a toy like some people, but Im accustomed to shooting large caliber rifles so that would be my first choice in rifles, and I enjoy shooting shotguns, I don't own very many small caliber rifles with the exception of my MKII and my 10/22 and I have fired a .17 HMR.

But yes, I feel you should carry what you are comfortable with, and if I have come off as dismissive to the .22 round and your suggestion, I apologize.


I'm well aware of how they work, and they do lose some *oopmh*. BUT, they don't lose an amount that would notice in the field. You know blowback type firearms are designed so the bolt doesn't come back until pressures in the chamber are at a safe level. If they didn't do this then yes, they would lose a large amount of speed.

Good post otherwise. I understand wanting something bigger, and so would high. When you add up all the pros of the .22LR it looks very attractive. It wouldn't be my cartridge for everything but it has a place.

[bandits1]

This thread is specifically about choosing one handgun in one caliber. Would you pro-.22 guys choose a handgun chambered for the .22 - over all other calibers - as your one and only weapon?

If your answer is "no" - why not?

[Whiterook]

A lot depends on where I am in this situation. How many magazines do I get if the gun takes magazines? How many rounds do I get?

If it is just what I own, probably my CZ-75B in 9mm. I have 3 magazines for it, a nice holster soon, and about 250 rounds of 9mm.

All my rifle would be too slow to load.

My other pistols don't have as many magazines.

If I had to pick one weapon out of anything, within reason I imagine, I would be torn between a 9mm Carbine, a .223 carbine, and a Ruger 10/22 with as many TacIn. 30 round mags I could carry.

The 9mm Carbine would probably be a Betetta Storm carbine or Kel-Tec.

The .223 would be a Robinson Arms Recon rifle. Although I may change that.

[bandits1]

A lot depends on where I am in this situation. How many magazines do I get if the gun takes magazines? How many rounds do I get?

If it is just what I own, probably my CZ-75B in 9mm. I have 3 magazines for it, a nice holster soon, and about 250 rounds of 9mm.

All my rifle would be too slow to load.

My other pistols don't have as many magazines.

If I had to pick one weapon out of anything, within reason I imagine, I would be torn between a 9mm Carbine, a .223 carbine, and a Ruger 10/22 with as many TacIn. 30 round mags I could carry.

The 9mm Carbine would probably be a Betetta Storm carbine or Kel-Tec.

The .223 would be a Robinson Arms Recon rifle. Although I may change that.
This thread is about handguns...not rifles. The OP states in the initial post that you can have as many magazines and spare ammo as you can carry. And it's not restricted to only weapons you currently own, you can choose any one handgun in any one caliber.

I'm just trying to reiterate what the point of this thread is: if you had to choose a single handgun in a single caliber, what would that choice be? Since so many people are arguing the merits of the .22 cal, I want to see how many would actually choose a .22 as their only means of protection in a ZPAW situation.

I'm guessing not too many. Why is that?

[Whiterook]

This thread is about handguns

I'm guessing not too many. Why is that?

Sorry, after 18 pages I was just used to seeing "one gun".

Why is that? Because if you can only have one handgun you need to find a happy medium.

Take something too large and you'll run out of ammo quick and your arm and wrist is going to regret it.

Take something too small like a .22 and you may have trouble against humans and zed encounters that really put the pressure on you.

So the happy medium for me would be a 9mm. My CZ-75B in 9MM, standard 16 round mags with 32 rounds available.

[UNDEAD FRED]

After seeing a few Dirty Harry movies a 44 magnum, not the most practical choice, but it is the best sounding zombie killer, It would take a zombies head clean off its shoulders.

[bandits1]

Sorry, after 18 pages I was just used to seeing "one gun".

Why is that? Because if you can only have one handgun you need to find a happy medium.

Take something too large and you'll run out of ammo quick and your arm and wrist is going to regret it.

Take something too small like a .22 and you may have trouble against humans and zed encounters that really put the pressure on you.

So the happy medium for me would be a 9mm. My CZ-75B in 9MM, standard 16 round mags with 32 rounds available.
Your point of choosing a "medium" caliber round like the 9mm was made by myself and several others many pages ago and is a very good one: choose the smallest caliber that can reliably penetrate the skull and make sure it's super-popular so it's relatively easy to scavenge ammo.

I was asking the "why" question to those who were defending the .22 as a viable zombie-killing round...and then not choosing it as their one caliber/one gun. If not even the pro-.22 peeps are going to choose it as their one-and-only round, doesn't it kind of prove what the .22 doubters are saying about the round being too weak and too underpowered to be relied upon to save your life in a ZPAW environment?

[Trumble0]

After seeing a few Dirty Harry movies a 44 magnum, not the most practical choice, but it is the best sounding zombie killer, It would take a zombies head clean off its shoulders.

I for one wouldnt mind a .44 or a little recoil, most depends on the load you're shooting, as he says in Magnum Force a light special in a .44 gives better control than a .357 wadcutter, but I'd want it to be a semi auto... .44 automag in Sudden Impact? maybe when I win the lottery... but until someone comes up with a decent semi besides Desert Eagle and IMI, I'll save my money.

BTW, Dirty Harry marathon is on AMC all this week... good old fashioned Police brutality. :lol:

[drjoe51]

why a pistol. If zombies invaded i would of have a Winchester M1897 Shotgun


:x

[bandits1]

why a pistol. If zombies invaded i would of have a Winchester M1897 Shotgun


:x
Relax. No one is saying they would choose to only have a single pistol on z-day. But this thread just happens to be only about handguns. There are threads that discuss only bolt-action rifles, or only hand-to-hand weapons, hell...there's even a thread discussing paintball guns.

If you want to start a thread that only discusses shotguns, go for it.

[Whiterook]

I was asking the "why" question to those who were defending the .22 as a viable zombie-killing round...and then not choosing it as their one caliber/one gun. If not even the pro-.22 peeps are going to choose it as their one-and-only round, doesn't it kind of prove what the .22 doubters are saying about the round being too weak and too underpowered to be relied upon to save your life in a ZPAW environment?



Not at all. If these zombies are slow moving zombies, face it, in a wide open area it ain't gonna be tough to take them down. ESPECIALLY where I will be in the woods/hills where these guys can't go. I'm fairly confident the .22LR would be effective there.

I could easily have 2 pistols(CZ75B and Buckmark) on me. In the sake of argument I put the CZ75B cause it does give solid protection. This does not mean a .22LR would not be a vital part of any survivalists arsenal.

[Hitman]

. the next time someone bags a deer with a small rack and doesn't care about mounting it, shoot it in the head with a .22 at those distances I bet the results would be alot different. I'm not disputing a .22 round would go through a stomach or chest, but I have a hard time believing even the High velocity .22 rounds would penetrate a human skull easily at a range. .


I've done that test already.
I shot it at 30 yards or so with a .22 pistol using subsonic ammo (and a silencer) just to see what it would do. in one side and out the other no problem. I then shot it from about 5 feet away. I was sprayed with brains squirting out the entrance holes.

[Tripoli]

I've done that test already.
I shot it at 30 yards or so with a .22 pistol using subsonic ammo (and a silencer) just to see what it would do. in one side and out the other no problem. I then shot it from about 5 feet away. I was sprayed with brains squirting out the entrance holes.

I did a similar test myself and got the same results as HitMan.

I also watched the video of another guy doing much the same thing with a pig’s head. It is common knowledge that the skull of a pig is slightly thicker than humans.

http://www.youtube.com/user/nightstalkerbob

I looked at the other tests he did and found then very convincing!

[Bob]

My personal choice would be a Glock17.
I have more than a few magazines for it and 4 of them are the 33 round ones.

While it would not be my first choice for the living I think it is the premier choice for Zombies.

22 LR is not quite reliable enough to suit me I much prefer centerfire when my butt is on the line.

My 1911 used to be my go to handgun but these days I like the high capacity of my G20 or G21.

IF I was limited to 22 LR I would go with a Ruger Mark III Hunter.

[DevilsRain]

I like the Smith and Wesson 617 in .22 LR. A .22 has what it takes to do the job on the UNDEAD. The Smith is a 10 shot revolver, mine has a 4 inch barrel, and is very accurate. The best part about the gun and caliber is, no magazines to loose, and the ammunition is light weight. After all, I am a girl, who can out shoot you boys. hee hee!

And I like the videos of nightstalkerbob.

[bandits1]

I like the Smith and Wesson 617 in .22 LR. A .22 has what it takes to do the job on the UNDEAD. The Smith is a 10 shot revolver, mine has a 4 inch barrel, and is very accurate. The best part about the gun and caliber is, no magazines to loose, and the ammunition is light weight. After all, I am a girl, who can out shoot you boys. hee hee!
Aaaaah! Two words I don't want associated with my one and only anti-zombie gun: ".22LR" and "revolver".

[Whiterook]

Aaaaah! Two words I don't want associated with my one and only anti-zombie gun: ".22LR" and "revolver".

You have to understand the tactic. It isn't raw power. It is reliability. Unless she loses the pistol or doesn't have access to ammo that is VERY common, she can shoot.

A .25 in the pocket is worth 2 AR15s in the trunk.

[bandits1]

You have to understand the tactic. It isn't raw power. It is reliability. Unless she loses the pistol or doesn't have access to ammo that is VERY common, she can shoot.

A .25 in the pocket is worth 2 AR15s in the trunk.
I understand the tactic perfectly...and 9mm is common enough for me.


...and as I stated earlier: I'd be willing to trade a bit of reliability for the high-cap mags of a Glock 17.

[DevilsRain]

hee hee hee, magazine feed firearms are great for the military. There is a built in resupply system to ensure that the soldiers can obtain new mags if the ones they have are lost or damaged. Law Enforcement carry semi-auto too but they don’t commonly shoot more than 1 magazine in any firefight. Yes, I saw the footage in L.A. with the BIG shootout and that is a 1 in a 10,000,000 event.

Hmm, “I'd be willing to trade a bit of reliability for the high-cap mags”. I have a couple of quick question for you “silly boy, if your Glock 17 fails because of a malfunction (reliability issue) then what good is all that high-cap mag stuff? I also wonder, where are you going to find these spare mags when the ones you have are lost or damaged?

Sure you can have a bunch of mags stored for use later. Remember we are talking “Zombies” only!

[Bob]

The thing is Glock sets the bar for reliability.
I personally ran a thousand rounds of lead ball through a Glock 21 with out cleaning it. At about 500 I was getting concerned about the lead build up in the barrel so I took a copper pan scrubber and drove a piece of it through the barrel to strip the lead out.
For the whole run I did not lubricate at all.
At the end there was so much wax (bullet lube) built up in the receiver you could scrape it out with a thumbnail. The Glock never missed a beat.
People go to great lengths trying to make them fail and don't succeed.

I will take the possibility of a failure for which we train over the time to reload a revolver in a high stress situation. Especially when you are dealing with cartridges as small as a 22.

Check this out for Glock reliability.

http://www.theprepared.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=90&Item
This one would stop a revolver

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpvWwc70uEM&feature=related
As would this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrZ0kxhDA3Y

[bandits1]

hee hee hee, magazine feed firearms are great for the military. There is a built in resupply system to ensure that the soldiers can obtain new mags if the ones they have are lost or damaged. Law Enforcement carry semi-auto too but they don’t commonly shoot more than 1 magazine in any firefight. Yes, I saw the footage in L.A. with the BIG shootout and that is a 1 in a 10,000,000 event.

Hmm, “I'd be willing to trade a bit of reliability for the high-cap mags”. I have a couple of quick question for you “silly boy, if your Glock 17 fails because of a malfunction (reliability issue) then what good is all that high-cap mag stuff? I also wonder, where are you going to find these spare mags when the ones you have are lost or damaged?

Sure you can have a bunch of mags stored for use later. Remember we are talking “Zombies” only!
True that semi-autos are generally more prone to fail or jam compared a revolver, but like Bob just mentioned, Glocks have been proven to be pretty damn reliable. Still - while I'm more likely to get eaten because of a failure or jam at the worst possible time, you're more likely to get eaten because of your more frequent - and generally slower - reloading due to comparatively low ammo capacity and your lower-powered rounds.

And as far as replacing damaged mags, I guess I'll try and find some the same way you'll be trying to find more ammo when you run out - by scrounging and scavenging. Where I live(much like the rest of the country) a lot of handgun owners shoot 9mm - and a fair amount of those guys shoot Glocks. And from what I understand the G17, G19, G26, G34 all use compatible magazines. Will it be easy to scavange spare mags? Not at all; but it won't be impossible.

You make some good points, but none have convinced me to choose a 10-shot .22LR revolver over a 17-shot Glock 9mm(or 19-22 shots with mag extenton...can't do that with a revolver ;-)).

[Whiterook]

My advice? Buy a cheap NEF .22LR revolver. They are very good quality and can be had for less than 150 dollars. Don't let the price fool you, they work good.

Throw in the bug out bag along with 500 rounds of CCI Mini-Mags. Great survivalist/back up revolver.

[BobZombie]

The problem with this thread is, “One Gun” theme. “If you could only carry one gun, a pistol, what would it be?” As far as pistols go, I wouldn’t want to carry one at all! Think about it, the range of a pistol SUCKS, the accuracy of a pistol SUCKS, the magazine capacity of a pistol SUCKS, (Yes, I know all about after market mags that offer volume.), and a pistol has a tendency to malfunction more often than a carbine or rifle, and that SUCKS too!

If I had to carry a “BACK-UP” pistol, then it would be a Ruger Mark-II or that S&W M-617. They are both fine weapons and the .22 caliber ammunition is VERY light. Besides, a 22 long rifle can exceed velocities of 1500 feet per second from a handgun! After all, the lady said, we are talking about “ZOMBES” and nothing else!

[zombiedad]

http://cyberpunk.net.pl/zbrojownia/bron_reczna/karabiny/szturmowe /gfx/keltecplr16.jpg
http://www.wilson-genealogy.com/pics/PLR-16.gif
A keltec plr16
This "pistol" is .223 cal & can use a 30 rd M4 clip!!

[Hitman]

I've not had many mags fail from damage or other abuse. and while I do get a jam now and again its pretty simple to clear it in any of my semi-auto pistols (tap- rack). the absolute worst jam I've ever had was in a revolver (colt python with factory ammo). the revolver had somehow jumped time ever so slightly and when fired , the forcing cone shaved part of the jacket off (around 30 rds into shooting this gun ) locking everything up extreemly tight. we ended up having to wrap the gun in a rag and beat the cylinder open with a mallet. he sent the gun to colt and they found nothing wrong with it. as far as I know of it still shoots fine to this day. I've never had a jam even close to that in an auto pistol. a broken firing pin in any gun will render it useless as will a broken main spring, trigger return spring ,squib (and they tend to be worse in revolvers than autos. autos don't generaly cycle, were as in the revolver its ready to blow with a second trigger pull) , etc.

I'll take a suppressed G19 over one of my revolvers any day .

[Bob]

I had the worst "OH MY GOD" jam ever yesterday.
It was bad ammunition, the gun would not go into battery (completely close).
I thought I was going to have to use a plastic hammer to get it open.
The ammunition was hand loaded 9mm given to me by a reloading buddy.
This is also why hand loads should not be used for self defense.
I trusted the quality of this guys hand loads.
I normally only shoot my own but was out of 9mm and he offered me a box of his hand loads that he had in the trunk of his car. The really scary thing is he considered these good enough to carry in the car for SHTF situations.


Always, Always, have a backup gun.

[Dave Of The Dead]

I'll tell you the one gun that I would NEVER try and base my survival on. My first gun, a .22 Rohm Revolver. This gun is so cheap, it goes for under 50 bucks. My fiance has shot this thing with me, and she's used to nice well-sighted guns. The shot straight and hit the ground 30 ft. in front of her. :drool: I've had to compensate for the horrible built in sights this thing has to the point where I don't even look through them anymore.

So my first would be a S&W SW9VE 9mm. Thats going to be the next gift for myself.

[Trumble0]

Worst Gun I've shot was my grandfathers old .45 Colt army, single action revolver, something was up with the cylinder so it started to "Shave lead" where the bullet would ever so slightly nick the side of the barrel and proceed to shoot lead shards and hot gas out the side of the cylinder. Coolest revolver ever was the S&W Model 29, Dirty Harry's gun :evil:

[Bob]

You need to get that revolver checked by a competent gunsmith.

[JakAttak]

or never shoot it again much cheaper

[Trumble0]

Yeah, we just keep it as a C&R (wallhanger) My Mosin Nagant 91/30 met a similar fate after it started to destroy casings. So I have to pick up another in the near future. I put so much work into that gun though, Re finished the stock, stained it a dark mahogany red, re-blued the metal including the spike Bayonet. But then again, if I get a new Mosin and don't put much work into it, it can be a "beater gun" like my synthetic stocks, well not exactly beater, but when you get a scratch or scuff on a synthetic stock its alot different than getting a gouge on a wooden stock, you start to cry when you ruin a wood stock. :cry:

[Gummerfan]

http://cyberpunk.net.pl/zbrojownia/bron_reczna/karabiny/szturmowe /gfx/keltecplr16.jpg
http://www.wilson-genealogy.com/pics/PLR-16.gif
A keltec plr16
This "pistol" is .223 cal & can use a 30 rd M4 clip!!
I looked at the PTR, but I decided on the Bushie Carbon-15 instead. It shares more components with my M4gery, plus, if I ever decide to SBR it it would be a lot easier than the PLR to install a buttstock.
If you DO have a PLR or Carbon-15, or any other AR pistol, you MUST install a Noveske "krink" compensator. It makes all the difference in the world regarding muzzle flash and blast. I can shoot my C15 without ear protection (not that I do). Before installing the comp, the flash/blast made it useless for any practical application.

[BioWeapon]

Kel Tec RFB, I love Bullpups.

Might want it in a caliber smaller than .308 though.... depends on local zombie density, and how much ammo I would need to carry.

[Trumble0]

That is a good point. I live in the middle of nowhere with like... 3 people every other square mile... so I think I'd be sitting pretty with however much 30-06 or .308 or .45 I could carry. Not like the massive waves of zombies 45 minutes away would be at my house anytime soon, or the possibility of ever.

[Zombie Slayer]

I would stick with my AK since the only firearms I own at the moment are that, a 9mm and a benelli tactical 12g...I'd be much better off with my AK IMO. Not that there aren't better weapons to choose from but my skill and training with the AK are FAR greater than any other firearm I've shot or own. I'd rather have a weapon that I am VERY comfortable with than have something considered more "state of the art" or "modern" and have never laid a hand on it. Just my 2 cents.:) Would love to own an M4 though.

[Emu]

I'm pretty sure you're planning on making every mistake in the book then.

1. .22lr: a round that has too small of a one-hit-kill ratio. Especially in a pistol, you're going to have a problem busting through the skull and doing much brain damage at any range outside of a few yards. Plus it leaves you with a *terrible* ability to fend of human targets.

2. .45apc: a round that will blow heads apart no problem and stop living men in their tracks, but limits your magazine capacity by a high degree. Especially in a 1911! If you're surrounded by 50 zombies, you don't want 8 round magazines.

3. .50 desert eagle: it's a round that's expensive to buy right now and will be impossible to find after z day, there are higher capacity revolvers, and the gun is renowned for being unreliable. Need I say more?

4. Metal Storm: You said it best, it's unrealistic. On top of that, it's a waste of ammunition. Precise head shots are the order of the day, not spray'n'pray guns.

sorry if it sounds like i'm picking on you!

I have to disagree with you on the .45 part, and reason is clip size. Look up Para Ordnance. They have the P14.15. That's 14 rounds of .45. they also have a P18.9 and P16.40. I would pick up one of those for Zday. Oh BTW Sig Sauer has a 226 that holds 19 in .9 and 14 in .40. Go to their site and look for the P226 X five.

[Gummerfan]

If you find yourself surrounded by 50 zombies, you've already committed an act of tactical self-fornication and you're doomed regardless.

[HunterGren]

As long as there the slow moving shuffle around type of zombies I would use my 44 magnum mateba. If they are the fast type of zombies then my glock 17.

http://http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c280/HunterGren/mateba_001.jpg

[Bob]

Take the money you would spend on a single para-ordiance and buy two Glocks.

[woody101]

my 1 gun would be a glock 18c, 7 magazines = well over 200 bullets coz its a 33 round mag.
plenty of bulllets.

[BenAli]

But honestly in all the zombie movies Ive seen, I've never seen or heard the suggestion to employ a .22 against a zombie...

OK…. You didn’t pay attention to Dawn of the Dead (original). . . Most every weapon was a .22 long rifle…. If you don’t know for sure, go watch the movie again.

[BenAli]

The .22 sucks, deal with it. I know a guy who was shot in the head at close range with a .22 pistol. The bullet entered at the forehead, skidded around the skull, and exited just above his ear. He's still walking around and fine today since the bullet never penetrated his skull. I also had a neighbor who attempted suicide by sticking a .22 pistol in his mouth. The bullet lodged in his upper pallet and again, he's fine today, thanks to the .22's lousy penetration.

OK… It is nice to make this statement… NOW! How about a little proof? Link to the NEWS report, medical report, or a photograph or two… Without that, your statement stands a BS!:poo:

[mattifikation]

No, not really. Nobody here is under any obligation to provide personal information about anybody they know, just because you're too stubborn and hard-headed to believe them.

You are merely some goof on the Internet. We owe you no proof of anything. We know the truth and we don't care what you think of it. Whether or not you believe us is irrelevant to whether or not we're telling the truth. We don't have to prove our accounts to a bunch of strangers on the Internet in order for them to be real. :-)

If you honestly don't believe that people can and have survived .22 shots to the head, then by all means make some Ruger POS your only means of self defense. Hopefully you'll never need to use it.

[beyerwrestler]

I want a gun that fires radioactive monkies that turn zeds into skittles!

But for the moment Ill just carry around my .357 ruger revolver

[Trumble0]

I want a gun that fires radioactive monkies that turn zeds into skittles!

But for the moment Ill just carry around my .357 ruger revolver

Wouldn't happen to be a Ruger GP100 would it? My brother has one in stainless, very nice gun, very solid.

[bandits1]

As I mentioned before: just the fact that so many people have to jump in and defend the .22 as viable anti-zombie round, eliminates it as a viable anti-zombie round.

Know what I mean?

Nobody has had to defend the 9mm as an reliable anti-zombie round. Nobody has had to defend the .38, the .45, the .357, etc... as reliable anti-zombie rounds. Only the .22 has had to have itself defended, and that fact alone should eliminate it from the "One gun" list.

[beyerwrestler]

Wouldn't happen to be a Ruger GP100 would it? My brother has one in stainless, very nice gun, very solid.


No its a Ruger Security 6 Revolver

[Trumble0]

No its a Ruger Security 6 Revolver

I Like it, styling reminds me alot of a S&W Model 29 or a Ruger Redhawk. What length barrel do you have on it?

[Bob]

Well I would rather have a .22 than a rock or a stick.

Most people on the gun forums agree that 9mm is the way to go.
When only penetrating head shots causing trauma to the brain counts it is superior to heavier rounds.
The most cost effective in terms of availability, weight, and monetary cost to stockpile is 115 gr ball. More than enough umph to penetrate and decimate the brain. While you won't get a Krönlein shot it will be more than sufficient.

My single biggest complaint with the 22 is it's lack of reliability.
I have fired more rounds than y'all would believe and have never had a factory round with a bad primer. With 22 it happens often enough that I would not trust them for self defense against the living or the un-dead. As for penetration, how many of have been shooting 22 and had one that didn't seem like it had the same sound or feel as the rest? Quality control on most 22 rim fire leaves much to be desired.

If I had to choose only one handgun for the undead it would be a Glock 17.
If I had to choose only one handgun for the living it would be a Glock 21.

[Dave Of The Dead]

I myself am starting to doubt the reliability of firing a .22 also. Yesterday I went plinking at a friend's place and found that at least 1 out of every 10 of my remington .22s didn't fire the first time through. Now this might have been my shitty $40 revolver I talked about earlier, or it might have been a bad batch. I'm suspecting the prior.

[Trumble0]

I myself am starting to doubt the reliability of firing a .22 also. Yesterday I went plinking at a friend's place and found that at least 1 out of every 10 of my remington .22s didn't fire the first time through. Now this might have been my shitty $40 revolver I talked about earlier, or it might have been a bad batch. I'm suspecting the prior.

If they were .22 Thunderbolts you're not alone, every round in the box sounds differently through my gun and I get quite a few duds.

[JakAttak]

you're just getting bad quality ammo. my dad buys 500 rnds for like $5.00 or 20 stinger rnds. for $10.00. The difference is incredible.

[Bob]

My favorite round for plinking is Federal 510.
At Wally World they are $1.47 a box of 50.
I buy them by the thousands.
The reliability is decent and most seem to shoot about the same.
I ran a batch over a chronograph a while back the consistency is decent.

On an average week I go to the range 3 times, I shoot between 1 and 2 hundred 22's every time I go. The actual amount of 22 depends on if I am shooting anything else.

I got a Ruger Charger earlier this year and while it's kind of neat I think you would be better off with a 22 rifle or a 22 pistol.
The S&W 22A is a pretty reliable 22 pistol but I don't like the plastic buffer.
They come with a couple of extra's and the factory will send you more no charge but I just have issues with a pistol that has a plastic part that wears out and needs to be changed every couple of thousand rounds.
I much prefer the Ruger Mark I and III. I don't have a Mark II but they are probably just as good as the others.

Mostly I shoot scoring targets but I sometimes shoot targets that are pictures of evil men like Chavez but they made me stop as he looks like a normal guy so people thought I was shooting a picture of my boss. However when I shoot pictures of the Supreme Ruler of Iran I get pats on the back. Most people don't actually recognize him they just figure he is a towel head so he must be bad. In actuality I think this is good practice for Zombie head shots. If you don't feel like making your own there are lots of places you can download targets, just crop out everything but the head print and shoot.
Here are a couple
http://www.targetz.com/novelty.htm
http://www.glockfaq.com/targets.htm

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9094/pistolaqj5.jpg

[BenAli]

No, not really. Nobody here is under any obligation to provide personal information about anybody they know, just because you're too stubborn and hard-headed to believe them.

You are merely some goof on the Internet. We owe you no proof of anything. We know the truth and we don't care what you think of it. Whether or not you believe us is irrelevant to whether or not we're telling the truth. We don't have to prove our accounts to a bunch of strangers on the Internet in order for them to be real. :-)

If you honestly don't believe that people can and have survived .22 shots to the head, then by all means make some Ruger POS your only means of self defense. Hopefully you'll never need to use it.

SO, what you are saying is a person can make a blanket statement and it should be taken as the truth without ANY PROOF? This alone is proof enough that the statement made is total BS.

I do believe a person can be shot in the head with a .22 lr. and survive. I also believe a person can be shot in the head by a .25, .32, .380, 9mm, .40, etc. etc and survive too…

This is an opinion thread so truly there is NO right or wrong answer to the “One gun” question. Again this thread is about “One gun” to combat the undead, NOT THE LIVING.

For others, cheap guns and cheap ammunition are poor choices.

[stizzorm]

Well, for starters, I really wouldn't want just one handgun in a zombie apocalypse. However, I like my police surplus Ruger GP100 DAO w/4" barrel. With practice, that's suitable for zeds or hunting.

[Gummerfan]

SO, what you are saying is a person can make a blanket statement and it should be taken as the truth without ANY PROOF? This alone is proof enough that the statement made is total BS.

I do believe a person can be shot in the head with a .22 lr. and survive. I also believe a person can be shot in the head by a .25, .32, .380, 9mm, .40, etc. etc and survive too…

This is an opinion thread so truly there is NO right or wrong answer to the “One gun” question. Again this thread is about “One gun” to combat the undead, NOT THE LIVING.

For others, cheap guns and cheap ammunition are poor choices.

Uhh, yeah, right. "Hey, Doc, can I get a copy of confidential medical records to post on a zombie website?" "Dude, remember that suicide attempt? I'm sure you don't care to dredge it up, but could you do so anyway?" "Hey, man! Long time no see! Mind if I snap a few pics of your scars? I need to show some total stranger on the internet that I didn't make up your story."
Sorry, don't see that happening.
Would you mind posting the serial number of your .22 so we can verify that you in fact own it?

[Bob]

Gummerfan

who are you asking for a serial number?

[Gummerfan]

Gummerfan

who are you asking for a serial number?
Because BA was making impossible demands, so I made an unreasonable one.
IOW, jus' bein' a smartass. ;)
It's not a good idea to post firearms serial #'s on the net,

[mattifikation]

SO, what you are saying is a person can make a blanket statement and it should be taken as the truth without ANY PROOF? This alone is proof enough that the statement made is total BS.


Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying. I could post no sources, a million sources, or even chose not to bring it up at all - it doesn't change whether or not it happened. It also doesn't prove anything about what may or may not have happened before. The only thing me not posting a source proves is that I don't care about you enough to go "prove" something that barely matters.

Right now I'm sitting on a porch and my car is parked in front of me. I could post "proof," but I'm not going to. If you choose not to believe me about my car, then fine - that just means I get to be right and you have to be wrong. The same thing applies to us telling you about the people we know who have survived .22 shots to the head.

Besides, what would you have me do? Dig through the local garbage dump for newspapers, looking for some obscure blurb that would be tucked away on page 17 in the police reports? Break into the hospital and steal people's medical records? Resurrect the guy's corpse, find all the pieces of his face that the 12 gauge took off, and have him come here and tell you for himself? Spend a week straight scouring the Internet for an online article about the guy that probably isn't even out there? Come off it, already!


I do believe a person can be shot in the head with a .22 lr. and survive. I also believe a person can be shot in the head by a .25, .32, .380, 9mm, .40, etc. etc and survive too…


People survived the nuclear attack of Hiroshima, too. Flukes happen. The point is to decrease their occurrence, since you can't stop them completely. Your argument is goofy since it could also be used to justify the use of a sling shot against zombies. "Oh, well sling shots can kill people sometimes, and it's not like other ammo has a 100% kill rate!"


This is an opinion thread so truly there is NO right or wrong answer to the “One gun” question. Again this thread is about “One gun” to combat the undead, NOT THE LIVING.


True, this is an opinion forum. However, if zombies were coming after you, your opinion isn't going to save you. Your bullets are. There have been reports about people being shot with .22's and not even being aware of it (don't whine about sources, just Google it. I'm not here to do your homework for you.) If it's so ineffective against the living, it's going to be even worse against the much more resilient undead hordes.

Anyways... what's with the font? That's as annoying as typing in all caps.

[Darkness]

"Ok children, behave yourselves, or I'm gonna have to get out the tranquillizer!" :evil: :lol:

[BenAli]

Uhh, yeah, right. "Hey, Doc, can I get a copy of confidential medical records to post on a zombie website?" "Dude, remember that suicide attempt? I'm sure you don't care to dredge it up, but could you do so anyway?" "Hey, man! Long time no see! Mind if I snap a few pics of your scars? I need to show some total stranger on the internet that I didn't make up your story."
Sorry, don't see that happening.
Would you mind posting the serial number of your .22 so we can verify that you in fact own it?

Sure, son. . . 12162. It is a Ruger. . . Why don't you try telling me the model#... I am positive I own more guns than you are years old.

[BenAli]

Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying. I could post no sources, a million sources, or even chose not to bring it up at all - it doesn't change whether or not it happened. It also doesn't prove anything about what may or may not have happened before. The only thing me not posting a source proves is that I don't care about you enough to go "prove" something that barely matters.

Right now I'm sitting on a porch and my car is parked in front of me. I could post "proof," but I'm not going to. If you choose not to believe me about my car, then fine - that just means I get to be right and you have to be wrong. The same thing applies to us telling you about the people we know who have survived .22 shots to the head.

Besides, what would you have me do? Dig through the local garbage dump for newspapers, looking for some obscure blurb that would be tucked away on page 17 in the police reports? Break into the hospital and steal people's medical records? Resurrect the guy's corpse, find all the pieces of his face that the 12 gauge took off, and have him come here and tell you for himself? Spend a week straight scouring the Internet for an online article about the guy that probably isn't even out there? Come off it, already!



People survived the nuclear attack of Hiroshima, too. Flukes happen. The point is to decrease their occurrence, since you can't stop them completely. Your argument is goofy since it could also be used to justify the use of a sling shot against zombies. "Oh, well sling shots can kill people sometimes, and it's not like other ammo has a 100% kill rate!"



True, this is an opinion forum. However, if zombies were coming after you, your opinion isn't going to save you. Your bullets are. There have been reports about people being shot with .22's and not even being aware of it (don't whine about sources, just Google it. I'm not here to do your homework for you.) If it's so ineffective against the living, it's going to be even worse against the much more resilient undead hordes.

Anyways... what's with the font? That's as annoying as typing in all caps.

Try getting a archived newspaper page from the net... without that it is all hot air! Try proving your point without the insults. Too hard?

[Gummerfan]

I am positive I own more guns than you are years old.
ROTFLMAO.
You don't know me very well, do you. :D

[DevilsRain]

I work as a medic and I have never seen or heard of such a thing. Shot by a gun and didn’t even know it? I’d like a lil proof too.

[Bob]

Isn't the mantra anywhere but the US "I know a guy who knows a guy who has a gun..."

I understand in the UK kids wear stab proof vests to school and some kitchen knives are regulated. Is this true?

[Gummerfan]

I work as a medic and I have never seen or heard of such a thing. Shot by a gun and didn’t even know it? I’d like a lil proof too.
I read a report in a gun mag years ago about a woman who was mugged and shot in the mouth with a .25.
She didn't realize she had been shot until she was talking to the 911 operator. Her mouth was bleeding and she felt one of teeth broken. She not only spat out the broken tooth, but also the bullet.
When Reagan was shot, he didn't know it at first. He told the Secret Service agent that he had broken his rib when the agent threw him in the car and jumped on top of him.
I'm sure such events are rare, but they do happen.

[beyerwrestler]

I Like it, styling reminds me alot of a S&W Model 29 or a Ruger Redhawk. What length barrel do you have on it?


This is the exact gun and I have 2 speedloaders for it too.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o222/walleyeguy6/100_0951.jpg

[DevilsRain]

A .22 is not a .25, all that kenetic energy and hydrostatic shock kind of thing. And if you read it, where is it?. Hmm? Gun goes BOOM! I think I have a broken rib. Sounds like they knew they were shot to me.

I guess silly boy, where is the newspaper account?

[mattifikation]

Try getting a archived newspaper page from the net... without that it is all hot air! Try proving your point without the insults. Too hard?

Once again, no. I'm not posting a source. I'm not spending hours upon hours scouring the Internet for an article that probably isn't even there. Stop asking. It's much more amusing to listen to you whine about sources than it is to do pointless research, and amusement is what I'm here for.

Besides, proof goes both ways. If you want to insinuate that I am lying, feel free to either prove it, or stop all this gum flapping about providing sources. :-)

(For the record, in a Court of Law, witness testimony is almost always considered better evidence than stuff on teh interwebz.)

[BenAli]

Once again, no. I'm not posting a source. I'm not spending hours upon hours scouring the Internet for an article that probably isn't even there. Stop asking. It's much more amusing to listen to you whine about sources than it is to do pointless research, and amusement is what I'm here for.

Besides, proof goes both ways. If you want to insinuate that I am lying, feel free to either prove it, or stop all this gum flapping about providing sources. :-)

(For the record, in a Court of Law, witness testimony is almost always considered better evidence than stuff on teh interwebz.)

If this is such a common occurrence, why would it take you hours to find it on the web? You witnessed this? Or, did you hear some story from a friend of a friend of a friend the was smoking dope whe he/she heard something form a friend… All BS without a link!

[Gummerfan]

A .22 is not a .25, all that kenetic energy and hydrostatic shock kind of thing. Granted, but in your post you didn't mention anything about a particular caliber, so I took a liberty. :) And if you read it, where is it?. As I said, it was years ago in one of the gun mags. Hmm? Gun goes BOOM!.25 acp goes POP! IIRC, the victim thought the perp had punched her in the mouth. I think I have a broken rib. Sounds like they knew they were shot to me.

I guess silly boy, where is the newspaper account?
The Reagan story was related to my Executive Protection class at Jacksonville State University. The instructor, Robert "Bob" Benson, was a friend of the agent in question. He said Reagan told him "You broke my rib!"
Here's a quote from "Reagan's Diaries" by Douglas Brinckley:
After being shot March 30, 1981 Reagan described how he didn't even realize it for quite a while....
"I walked into the emergency room and was hoisted onto a cart where I was stripped of my clothes. It was then we learned I'd been shot and had a bullet in my lung. Getting shot hurts."

[Rip Denver]

i'm more of a blunt object sort of guy.
you know, wooden bat, broken leg off a table, weight lifting bar, ect...

[mattifikation]

If this is such a common occurrence, why would it take you hours to find it on the web? You witnessed this? Or, did you hear some story from a friend of a friend of a friend the was smoking dope whe he/she heard something form a friend… All BS without a link!

It came to me in a dream as I sipped from the Springs of Prophecy at the Cave of the Oracle - And the suicide attempts I have described are actually the fate that I have foreseen for you! Or perhaps it was I, who made the repeated ill-fated suicide attempts, and it is merely my ghost surfing the Internet today. There's even a slight chance that I am God Himself, relating to you a small fraction of my omniscience so that you may find truth and be awakened!

*yawn*

The answer is still "no." You need not remind me yet again that you take zombies so seriously that you demand sources for everything on here, and that you refuse to believe me. I am aware of this. I will stop telling you that I don't care if you believe me when you stop demanding that I take some effort to make you believe.

In the meantime, I am llllloving the picture I've got of you in my head, fuming at the mouth over the fact that some scoundrel online would be as arrogant as I am. It's why I'm still talking to you - and frankly, the only reason.

How dare I refuse to appease the source-demanding gods?! What ignorance is this, that I should flat out, pointedly REFUSE to provide evidence of my story?! This is preposterous! I'm not even merely avoiding the issue... I'm refusing all together! My GOD! The Internet will surely DIE! :lol:

Listen, I can't prove my story any more than you can prove that it isn't true. Unless you think you can. Go on though, I challenge you. I'm talking definitive stuff, not just "well you don't have a source so it's proven false." That doesn't work because for example, I also don't have a source proving that you are a real person and not some automated drone with AI.

Failing that, I challenge you to find me a legitimate source, such as a ballistics expert or somebody who has shot a shit ton of people in the head, stating that the .22 is as reliable at penetrating skulls and destroying enough gray matter to take a person down as .38 or 9mm is.

And should you be unable to do either of those, please, demand sources again and blindly spew the letters "B" and "S," because secretly I've been assigning them to mean "butt sandwich" throughout this thread and it makes me giggle when you say it. :lol:

[Darkness]

*Darkness gets out the double barreled tranquillizer gun and loads both barrels.*

"A: Settle down! It's ok to disagree, just agree to disagree and move on."

"B: This is a ZOMBIE Forum, Stop Talking About Shooting Humans!!"

And
"C: Who cares if it can be proven? It's just a conversation about killing Zombies!"

"Now behave and get back to the topic, or I'm gonna start shooting darts!"

[DevilsRain]

Matt, Matt, Matt, Silly boy. If you can provide proof then do so. If not quit ranting about how special you are. I’d like to see some facts too. Now play nice and “show me the money.’

[Trumble0]

I have also heard stories... but again they were oral, but... I did find an online new report. here it is. http://www.wibw.com/localnews/headlines/20659574.html

I'm sure I could find more if I spent more time, but I have to get dressed and goto Prison/Correctional Philosophy

[automaton]

There are thousands of reports where people have been shot in the head and survived without defect. From the lil research I did it is clear, from a .22 to buckshot there is NO one gun for a zombie. I’ll keep my reliable .22 lr and be happy.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18790581/?GT1=9951
Of course the bullet traveled through the walls of his mobile home before hitting the man in the head.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26604942/
What a shame the caliber wasn’t mentioned.

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/bryan_10906___article.html/county_raley.html
“several rounds of buckshot into a sheriff's deputy's head”

And he survived?

“Holmes County Sheriff's Deputy Sgt. Michael Raley was treated for non-life-threatening injuries and released from Doctor's Memorial Hospital in Bonifay”

http://kezi.com/news/local/42478
Another non-mention of the caliber.

http://newsguru.newsvine.com/_news/2008/04/17/1437289-woman-shot-between-the-eyes-only-needs-stitches
I think I need a bigger gun… This one was a .44 cal and all she needed was stitches?

http://gregplancich.newsvine.com/_news/2007/01/21/530967-plucky-duck-survives-two-gunshots-and-two-days-in-fridge
Can there be ZOMBIE DUCKS?

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080428_11_After73577
50% & 50% need I say more?

[Trumble0]

IDK... I tend to take the media reports of shootings with a grain of salt.... or more like a pound of salt. These are the same people who refer to any weapon with a detachable magazine as an "Assault Weapon." and are "gun-grabbing" liberals. It's too bad my State is getting almost as bad as the People's Republik of Kalifornia. Honestly, my state chooses to ban guns based on physical appearance. Semi-Auto guns that accept detacheble mags can only have 2 or less of the following traits or else theyre illegal.
1) Bayonet lug.
2) Flash supressor or Muzzle Brake
3) A Pistol grip "protruding conspiciously" beneath the action.
If it is a Pistol:
4) Magazines load forward of the handgrip... Im not sure, they might have banned all of those due to the dreaded "Tek-9!!!!" everyone knows only Criminals use Tek-9's... it is forbidden by Name as well in NY, along with AR-15, Street Sweeper. and all those other cool sounding names.

Anyway, I got totally off topic, but NY is crippling me in the event of a Zombie Outbreak, due to public outcry from the media's ignorance of firearms.

[Bob]

Which is worse NY or MA?

People get blown up by bombs and land mines and live to tell the tale why not a head shot.

Just like a land mine I would expect head shot survivors to have diminished capacity. Legs vs Mental acuity both are terrible things to lose.

[Trumble0]

Which is worse NY or MA?

People get blown up by bombs and land mines and live to tell the tale why not a head shot.

Just like a land mine I would expect head shot survivors to have diminished capacity. Legs vs Mental acuity both are terrible things to lose.

Ive heard alot of horror stories about both... I guess Senator Ted Kennedy basically outlawed guns in MA awhile ago, and theyre on their way to going that way here. I don't get it though... Springfield Arms is in Mass. and the people like aren't even allowed to own the guns made there.

IDK if theres a member on here from Mass. Im sure they could clarify, but Ive heard Kennedy got rid of most of them.

. I saw a bumper sticker at the Gunshow this weekend that pretty much sums my sentiments up... "Tyrants prefer unarmed peasants..."

[Bob]

I have friends and family in MA.
They can't have slingshots.

[bandits1]

Just one thing: are all the people who are backing up the .22 saying they would choose it as their one caliber in the their one gun?

Because that's what this thread is about.

If all the handguns in all the calibers were layed out in front of you, you pro-.22 peeps are saying that you would grab a handgun chambered in .22 above all others?

[Whiterook]

If all the handguns in all the calibers were layed out in front of you, you pro-.22 peeps are saying that you would grab a handgun chambered in .22 above all others?

How much ammo is with each gun?

[bandits1]

How much ammo is with each gun?
As much as you can carry.

This thread isn't about guns you already own; you are free to choose any handgun in any caliber - cost notwithstanding.

Who here would choose a pistol chambered in .22 as their one-and-only weapon?

[Whiterook]

As much as you can carry.

This thread isn't about guns you already own; you are free to choose any handgun in any caliber - cost notwithstanding.

Who here would choose a pistol chambered in .22 as their one-and-only weapon?

I've already said my CZ-75B in 9mm with as many full mags I can carry. I may change it though the more I think about it. If we say this is the only gun I'm going to have, ever, and cannot scrounge for ammo, ever...then I will take a .22 pistol.

[bandits1]

I've already said my CZ-75B in 9mm with as many full mags I can carry. I may change it though the more I think about it. If we say this is the only gun I'm going to have, ever, and cannot scrounge for ammo, ever...then I will take a .22 pistol.
So you'd choose the handgun you already own over any other handgun on the planet? Cool.

I think the way this scenario is layed out you can have only one handgun for the rest of your life, but you can scrounge for ammo whenever you need to, which is why choosing a very popular caliber is important. In the long run, ammo avalibility is more important than power.

But like I posted earlier, I haven't read anything to make me change my mind about my choice of a Glock 17.

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/2914/glock17torchunitjpgyb5.jpg

[DevilsRain]

As much as you can carry.

This thread isn't about guns you already own; you are free to choose any handgun in any caliber - cost notwithstanding.

Who here would choose a pistol chambered in .22 as their one-and-only weapon?

The answer is, yes. This thread is about one gun and I would choose a .22. As I could have as much ammunition as I could carry.

With the .22 a person can carry 4 to 7 times more rounds than a 9mm, 40S&W, .45ACP or other large pistol calibers. Again, we are talking about destroying the undead and not defending ourselves from the living.

I also like the .22 for its low recoil and the reliability of my gun. I am a little gal and shooting bigger guns are difficult.

Why all the hate for the pro .22 people? Seriously, I don’t see how a person’s opinion to choose a .22 can spark so much hate. I’ll stay with my Smith and be happy. You can keep your choice and be happy too after all there is no right answer, is there?

[Darkness]

You can keep your choice and be happy too after all there is no right answer, is there?

"Well put! Finally, another female with a brain!!" :)

[Bob]

You may be right and there is no right answer but some are more correct than others.

For example the FN 5.7 pistol might be an awesome choice due to low recoil (supposedly half that of 9mm) and it's high capacity (20) plus the low weight of the ammunition (supposedly half that of 9mm) but where are you going to find ammunition for it? SG1? Maybe the folks in Atlantis would hook you up with a few thousand rounds.

I did not actually research these facts I just did a quick look up on wikipededia. If anyone actually does check into it further I would be interested in what you find.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_Five-seven

Pound for pound it's hard to argue with 22 but I would without a doubt take a Glock 17.

[Trumble0]

For example the FN 5.7 pistol might be an awesome choice due to low recoil (supposedly half that of 9mm)

I've never exactly thought of the 9mm as being a handcannon :lol:

But yeah I know what you're saying, some people who don't have much gun experience might be put off it because they don't expect recoil. And maybe those who have extensive gun knowledge would pick it because it would improve the accuracy of follow up shots, other than the obviously stated fact that 9mm is one of the easiest ammunitions to stumble acrossed. The way I look at it though Less recoil equates to lesser power. if someone were worried about recoil they could stock up right now on some really light grain ammunition, and it would have the same effect. I know after a couple clips of 220 grain through my 30-06, I lose any desire to load another clip in it lol, then my 150 grain reloads start to look tempting.

[bandits1]

The answer is, yes. This thread is about one gun and I would choose a .22. As I could have as much ammunition as I could carry.

With the .22 a person can carry 4 to 7 times more rounds than a 9mm, 40S&W, .45ACP or other large pistol calibers. Again, we are talking about destroying the undead and not defending ourselves from the living.

I also like the .22 for its low recoil and the reliability of my gun. I am a little gal and shooting bigger guns are difficult.

Why all the hate for the pro .22 people? Seriously, I don’t see how a person’s opinion to choose a .22 can spark so much hate. I’ll stay with my Smith and be happy. You can keep your choice and be happy too after all there is no right answer, is there?
Relax. I'm not hating on your choice, it's just that a lot of the people who are backing up the .22 didn't actually come out and say they would choose a .22 handgun as their one-and-only. In fact, a lot of them chose another caliber, mostly 9mm.

Just trying to get a straight answer from everyone. In the context of this thread, it's kinda pointless to argue about how much you would trust the .22 and then not choose it as the caliber of your only handgun.

[Hitman]

You may be right and there is no right answer but some are more correct than others.

For example the FN 5.7 pistol might be an awesome choice due to low recoil (supposedly half that of 9mm) and it's high capacity (20) plus the low weight of the ammunition (supposedly half that of 9mm) but where are you going to find ammunition for it? SG1? Maybe the folks in Atlantis would hook you up with a few thousand rounds.

I did not actually research these facts I just did a quick look up on wikipededia. If anyone actually does check into it further I would be interested in what you find.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_Five-seven

Pound for pound it's hard to argue with 22 but I would without a doubt take a Glock 17.

I've shot a five-seven . it is every thing they say , accurate , almost no recoil, reliable, very light weight (loaded its lighter than an empty G17) , high mag capacity (with a 10 round mag extenstion avail). the round is lacking in power , but the center fire is far more reliable than rimfire priming and the bullet seals the case much better than heel type bullets (most .22lr bullets can be spun while holding the case) . I'd pick this as my main zombie pistol if I had one , even with the limited ammo supply that I have if all I had to worry about was human zombies , dog zombies I'd want a little bit bigger round.

I didn't have any 28 gr 5.7 at the time .


just out of curosity I weighed 10,000 rounds of .22lr . it was just at 85 pounds . I then weighed one .22lr (remington subsonic) it was 50.3 gr , one round of 9mm ( 115gr monarch) it was 180gr , .45acp (230gr fmj ) was 329gr , 12ga 1oz slug was 658 , and 12 00 buck (winchester 9 pellet) was 700 gr, 5.57 m855 was 185gr , 7.62x39 123gr fmj was 252gr, .308 145gr fmj was 346gr , and 5.7X28 40gr V-max was 107gr .

[Whiterook]

So you'd choose the handgun you already own over any other handgun on the planet? Cool.




Uh yeah. Nice condescending tone.

I know how it shoots. I can hit with it. I know what it can do. I know its ins and outs.


it's kinda pointless to argue about how much you would trust the .22 and then not choose it as the caliber of your only handgun.


In the context of this thread, maybe. But there was a point for a long time where we weren't arguing that and it was just about the .22lr.

[bandits1]

Uh yeah. Nice condescending tone.

I know how it shoots. I can hit with it. I know what it can do. I know its ins and outs.
My bad - I didn't mean for it come out sounding condescending. I just wanted to reiterate what the choices were.

Those are good points about wanting to use a gun you are 100% familiar with in a time of extreme crisis, and I've read the CZ-75B is real good gun and very accurate.

I would gladly take this version of it:

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/9750/pict0072fq8vp9.jpg

[Tripoli]

I've shot a five-seven . it is every thing they say , accurate , almost no recoil, reliable, very light weight (loaded its lighter than an empty G17) , high mag capacity (with a 10 round mag extenstion avail). the round is lacking in power , but the center fire is far more reliable than rimfire priming and the bullet seals the case much better than heel type bullets (most .22lr bullets can be spun while holding the case) . I'd pick this as my main zombie pistol if I had one , even with the limited ammo supply that I have if all I had to worry about was human zombies , dog zombies I'd want a little bit bigger round.

I didn't have any 28 gr 5.7 at the time .


just out of curosity I weighed 10,000 rounds of .22lr . it was just at 85 pounds . I then weighed one .22lr (remington subsonic) it was 50.3 gr , one round of 9mm ( 115gr monarch) it was 180gr , .45acp (230gr fmj ) was 329gr , 12ga 1oz slug was 658 , and 12 00 buck (winchester 9 pellet) was 700 gr, 5.57 m855 was 185gr , 7.62x39 123gr fmj was 252gr, .308 145gr fmj was 346gr , and 5.7X28 40gr V-max was 107gr .

1 Pound = 7,000 grains

10,000 round - .22lr = 85 lbs.

5.7X28 40gr V-max = 107gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = = = 152.85 lbs.
9mm (115gr monarch) it = 180gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = 257.14 lbs.
.45acp (230gr fmj) = 329gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = = = = 470 lbs.
12ga 1oz slug = 658gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = = = = = = 940 lbs.
12 00 buck (Winchester 9 pellet) = 700 gr, - - 10,000 rounds = 1,000 lbs.
5.57 m855 was 185gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = = = = = = 264.28 lbs.
7.62 x 39 WARSA (123gr fmj) = 252gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = 360 lbs.
.308 NATO (145gr fmj) = 346gr - - 10,000 rounds = = = = = = = 494.28 lbs.

[Zombie Slayer]

Damn...so for my AK I would want to carry at least 1,000 rnds with me if I am on the move. That equates to 36 lbs of ammo. With a back pack that wouldn't be too difficult as long as I am up against shamblers and not the quick little buggers. At the very least I'd take 500 rnds just to be on the safe side. Also, that would be the extra ammo I'd be carrying...not what I'd already have in my extra mags (1-5 rnd, 1-10 rnd, 1-20 rnd, 1-40 rnd and a 75 rnd drum) and loaded rifle with a 30 rnd...thank god I am in pretty good shape. :)

[Trumble0]

I think it would be managable, wear ACU pants or Tactical pants with pockets for mags, a sturdy backpack with plenty of room, and one of those OD Green Duffle bags filled with ammo and maybe a few extra pistols or a small carbine or a short barreled shotgun, have a gun with a sling on your shoulder at the ready and a pistol on your hip or ideally in a drop leg holster, so you can set down the bag and shoot the zombies you need to and grab it again when you're clear. Just get a partner, One person would be an ammunition packmule, and the other would carry essential supplies, food, water, medicine, etc... 2 People could swing carrying alot of ammo that is a higher caliber than .22LR. Plus IDK about anyone else... but I'm going to be travelling in style, our M35 Deuce and a Half is built sturdy enough to plow it's way through road obstructions. It's got a re-inforced chassis because it had a crane on the back at one point, so it still has hydraulic stabilizers, the only crappy thing is, it was converted to gasoline, so it doesn't run on diesel anymore, which would probably be in large supply because not alot of people drive diesel cars/trucks in my area. I could tie down alot of ammo on the back of that beast, and find someplace to hole up and make trips bringing in the ammo while someone covered my six.

[Zombie Slayer]

Absolutely, I would love to have some type of light armored vehicle or APC or even just a Hummer to travel in. Unfortunately for me, at the moment I only have a car and a Ninja 650r. :cry:

[Gummerfan]

Since size and weight are important factors, I guess THIS wouldn't be a good choice, would it? :lol::)
If my bid on Gunbroker holds out, I'll have one o' these in a week or so.
Giggety!

[Darkness]

Absolutely, I would love to have some type of light armored vehicle or APC or even just a Hummer to travel in. Unfortunately for me, at the moment I only have a car and a Ninja 650r. :cry:

"If you wish to talk transportation, please go here....."
http://www.allthingszombie.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14311

"This particular thread is for Gun Talk only. Thank you." ;-)

[Tripoli]

Damn...so for my AK I would want to carry at least 1,000 rnds with me if I am on the move. That equates to 36 lbs of ammo. With a back pack that wouldn't be too difficult as long as I am up against shamblers and not the quick little buggers. At the very least I'd take 500 rnds just to be on the safe side. Also, that would be the extra ammo I'd be carrying...not what I'd already have in my extra mags (1-5 rnd, 1-10 rnd, 1-20 rnd, 1-40 rnd and a 75 rnd drum) and loaded rifle with a 30 rnd...thank god I am in pretty good shape. :)

4235 rounds of .22 lr. = 36 lbs. Hmm?

I am not trying to convince anyone of anything.

Given the math, a .22 lr. isn’t all bad. For the living I would like something a little stronger. However, when the dead rise a .22 handgun is my choice too.

Yes, I've changed my mind over the .45 acp.

[Zombie Slayer]

I hear you Tripoli, a .22 would do fine IMO, I'm just putting myself in the "if it went down right now" situation in which case the only firearms in my apt. would be my AK and 12g. so I would have to make due. Now then, if I came across a .22 then there's no way in hell I would leave it...ANY firearm is better than going toe to toe with mr. zed and being able to carry over 4 times the .22 ammo than my 7.62x39, that has got give some peace of mind to whoever is carrying it. Not to mention the almost non existant recoil and sound (when compared to higher caliber ammo) that is a big plus for those who aren't to experienced with firearms. To bad for me that I don't own one at the moment. :-(

[Tripoli]

I hear you Tripoli, a .22 would do fine IMO, I'm just putting myself in the "if it went down right now" situation in which case the only firearms in my apt. would be my AK and 12g. so I would have to make due. Now then, if I came across a .22 then there's no way in hell I would leave it...ANY firearm is better than going toe to toe with mr. zed and being able to carry over 4 times the .22 ammo than my 7.62x39, that has got give some peace of mind to whoever is carrying it. Not to mention the almost non existant recoil and sound (when compared to higher caliber ammo) that is a big plus for those who aren't to experienced with firearms. To bad for me that I don't own one at the moment. :-(

What I am thinking is a.22 lr. HANDGUN only provides 25 yard of effectiveness. After that the round and accuracy is screwed! Like you said, “being able to carry over 4 times the .22 ammo than my 7.62x39” is wonderful too.

Did you notice the weight of the 9mm and .45 acp? The 9 is a little lighter and the .45 is a LOT heavier. 9mm = 25.7 lbs. per 1,000 & the .45 acp = 47 lbs per 1,000? It is about 3 to 1 with the 9mm and almost 5.5 to 1 with the .45 acp.

Besides, most shooters will not get more than 25 yards from their handgun either. The sights on a pistol to not accommodate longer distances! Any pistol shooter knows this. There is an exception for specialty handguns or sights but not so much when it comes to shooters.

Distances greater than 25 yards takes extra skills beyond the normal shooter.

[Bob]

I have a friend who can knock down rams at 100 yards using a 1911 chambered in 45 acp with iron sights. He does not use standard 230 grain ball to do it though.
You are right though past 25 yards takes more than average skill.

[Trumble0]

I have a friend who can knock down rams at 100 yards using a 1911 chambered in 45 acp with iron sights. He does not use standard 230 grain ball to do it though.
You are right though past 25 yards takes more than average skill.

That is quite a feat... I'm hoping I can get at least above average with a pistol. I'm about average at the moment, But I need to get a steadier hand.

Jim: Look at this
Sheriff Bart: Steady as a rock...
Jim: Yeah, but this is the hand I shoot with *hand shakes violently*
:lol:

[Tripoli]

I have a friend who can knock down rams at 100 yards using a 1911 chambered in 45 acp with iron sights. He does not use standard 230 grain ball to do it though.
You are right though past 25 yards takes more than average skill.

Yes, that is good shooting... I can do the same with my .38 snubby, .40 S&W, 10mm, & .45acp. But could I do this while a shambler is coming at me from 75 t0 100 yards away?:evil: I hope so... :lol:

[StorytellaX7]

id probobly have to take a Glock 20 10mm 15rd clip with me or a Browning 9mm Hi Powered MK3 10rd

[Bob]

Tripoli
A 38 snubbie?
What model is it and what kind of ammunition were you using?

[Tripoli]

Bob, it is Smith Model 60. I was shooting Remington .38 special 148gn. TMWC. It takes practice and I started at 25 yards and worked my way out to 100. I could hit 4 out of 6 consistently.

[Trumble0]

That is pretty cool... I was always under the impression that snubnoses weren't accurate for very far. Like the "Saturday Night Specials" with no front sight, I always pictured a snubnose as a nasty close quarters gun, almost like a "Lemon Squeezer" for pumping some lead into someone's guts. :scare:

[Tripoli]

It is true a “snubby” is known as a belly gun. Saturday Night Specials (SNS) is usually a “cheep” weapon, in the day under $100. Today, the SNS are still out there but for the most part people are aware of their poor performance. If you buy a cheep gun you will get cheep performance. A quality snub nose revolver can and does work wonders.

[Bob]

The problem with most small revolvers is the sights are small and close together.

Shooting a pocket revolver at 100 yards the sights would be useless. All they would be good for is perhaps the horizontal plane.

When I shoot a Colt 1911 with MMC sights using 230 grain ball at 100 yards thats all the sights are good for.

My friend uses a 200 grain bullet loaded stiff to get the velocity up.

[Whiterook]

You guys would probably be surprised with how accurate a snub nose revolver can be. A single-action trigger helps A LOT but if you do your part you can nail things at 100 yards with them.

[Bob]

If you want to really know how bad you suck you need to shoot silhouette.
Shooting Rams (or really any of the other animals) is a binary thing like shooting Zed in the head.
There is no 9 ring, it's bullseye or nothing.
There is a difference in a huge piece of paper and a small piece of steel.
I see people all the time blast the crap out of a B-27 and act happy as a pig in shite when half the shots are in what they gleefully call the K-Zone.

[Trumble0]

On an unrelated to snubnose topic...

My buddy just got a Hi-point .40 pistol. I didn't get to shoot it, I guess he says it weighs alot, but he said it shoots pretty smooth, didn't have any FTF problems related to the gun, just the new spring in the mag, after a couple mags he said it resolved itself. Said it shot pretty accurate, comes with a replacement ghost ring rear sight. Said its smooth as butter to double tap with. Im going to buy other guns, but a hi-point will definitely be on my purchase list, for $100 something if it's a piece of shit it's not a big loss. I know we've discussed Hi-points before and the general consensus was theyre junk... but I still want one.

[Whiterook]

I wouldn't say they are junk Trumble. They are much better than the Ring of Fire pistols like Jennings and Davis, etc etc.

A couple of my friends have hi-points. The one in .40 jammed a bit but it was a new gun and could probably be worked out. The 9mm worked fine. I'd be interested in getting one for a few reasons. I think it would be a good pistol to just throw in the car or backpack when I hike/camp. If I took it to the range and put 100 rounds through it no problem than I would have some confidence in it.

They are a decent value, ugly and heavy and not for CC, but a decent pistol for someone who can't afford anything else. Also, like I said, a good truck or camping gun. The carbines are supposed to be better too.

My only problem with them is that at a gun-store you will probably pay 150 new, before taxes. Maybe less, maybe more. For around the same price you can find a few C&R pistols that are much better.

[Trumble0]

I wouldn't say they are junk Trumble. They are much better than the Ring of Fire pistols like Jennings and Davis, etc etc.

A couple of my friends have hi-points. The one in .40 jammed a bit but it was a new gun and could probably be worked out. The 9mm worked fine. I'd be interested in getting one for a few reasons. I think it would be a good pistol to just throw in the car or backpack when I hike/camp. If I took it to the range and put 100 rounds through it no problem than I would have some confidence in it.

They are a decent value, ugly and heavy and not for CC, but a decent pistol for someone who can't afford anything else. Also, like I said, a good truck or camping gun. The carbines are supposed to be better too.

My only problem with them is that at a gun-store you will probably pay 150 new, before taxes. Maybe less, maybe more. For around the same price you can find a few C&R pistols that are much better.

Yeah, another one of my friends has the 9MM carbine it's a fun gun... but again, it's not very pretty. I like the aesthetics of the Beretta CX4 Storms better.

I know what you're talking about with Jennings exactly... My dad has a Jennings J22, besides being the most ridiculously small and uncomfortable guns to shoot, it jams after 1 shot. Could just be a problem with the extractor... but my dad's business partner got the same gun at the same time, and has long gotten rid of his due to mechanical problems... I think about now if you don't hit the person with the first shot, your only course of action would be to whip the gun at them, but then of course based on Murphy's law, it would cycle in another round and go off and shoot you.

I'm torn between what caliber I would get for the Hi-point... the department Im goign to work for carry .40 so i could get all the brass i want for reloading... but I like the stopping power of a .45. :think:

[Dave Of The Dead]

I've been looking at a Hi-Point Carbine just for a plinking and home defense rifle. I think the 9mm is popular enough and effective enough to be one of my top choices. I'd be gitty as a school girl to shoot the .45 though. I'm still deciding on what I want. I've seen so many people talk crap about Hi-Point just because they are one of the cheapest brands out there, but from the actual user reviews, both the handguns and carbines get good scores in both accuracy and dependability, and of course price!

[superagent23]

a f17 with silver bullets with a silencer scope attachment

[Bob]

Have a friend who is a commercial reloader and gunsmith who says for the price they can't be beat. They work and will eat about anything you feed them. He says they are butt ugly butt they work.

I don't have one but who knows what tomorrow will bring.

I agree with having one as a trunk gun.

[Gummerfan]

I've heard a lot of the same things about the Hi-Points (pistols and carbines). They're cheap, ugly, and clunky. They have no resale value ( most pawn shops won't even loan money on them). But people who actually own them testify that they're pretty reliable and dependable.
And there'e a replacement stock for the carbines that pretty closely mimics the Beretta's look.


PS-I just spoke to my FFL dealer today, and "Pu**ycakes" is on the way!!!:love: :evil:

[bandits1]

On an unrelated to snubnose topic...

My buddy just got a Hi-point .40 pistol. I didn't get to shoot it, I guess he says it weighs alot, but he said it shoots pretty smooth, didn't have any FTF problems related to the gun, just the new spring in the mag, after a couple mags he said it resolved itself. Said it shot pretty accurate, comes with a replacement ghost ring rear sight. Said its smooth as butter to double tap with. Im going to buy other guns, but a hi-point will definitely be on my purchase list, for $100 something if it's a piece of shit it's not a big loss. I know we've discussed Hi-points before and the general consensus was theyre junk... but I still want one.
If $100 isn't a big deal to you, why don't you just get spend a bit more and get something nicer?

Just wondering.

[mattifikation]

My question is, when you pull it out to defend your life and it jams because it's such a cheaply made piece of shit, and you take a zombie bite to the arm (or a bullet to the face, for that matter) is it still not a big loss?

[Trumble0]

My question is, when you pull it out to defend your life and it jams because it's such a cheaply made piece of shit, and you take a zombie bite to the arm (or a bullet to the face, for that matter) is it still not a big loss?

If I were to get one I'd use it as just a range gun, or a plink'ster. Or for butchering around the farm. If I'm going to CCW I'd probably just carry my Department issued Glock until I bought a Taurus or something. Maybe a PPK as a backup gun.

[Whiterook]

Yeah I don't think anyone is going to argue carrying one for daily personal protection. I mean, some people can't afford anything else and may have to. A Hi-Point is better than nothing.

I think the best thing about the Hi-Point would be to take the carbine or pistol somewhere you don't want your finely blued Beretta or CZ, or your 600 dollar Glock. You know, have it laying in your trunk on a long trip, in your backpack hiking or camping. I know I don't want my nice pieces there, at least not right now. There are better options(used or surplus) for that but hey, can't hurt having a Hi-Point if you take it for what it is.

[Hitman]

I'd get a CZ52 or a nagant way before I'd get a high point. the CZ 52 can be fed for way cheaper also . there are some used sigs and of course the H&K P7's that are police trade ins out there .

there is no good reason to get a known shoddily built pistol unless you want that one gun. I keep hearing that they are great , but I've seen broken guns of simular construction (far too many). any one know the round count life of a high-point ? 500 rounds ,10k ? I probly put 1500+ through my glock alone per year .

[Bob]

Y'all are coming off as gun snobs.

If it's all someone can afford then I say go for it just shoot it enough to know what to expect and if it won't feed or eject then get rid of it and try something else.

Not everyone that needs or wants a pistol can afford one of the better ones.
It's easy to say I wouldn't have one of them there el-cheapo pieces of crap when you CAN afford a good pistol. To some people $150 is a lot of money.

I don't have a highpoint but I may have to get one just so I can do a range test and prove or disprove their reliability.

Feed a CZ cheaper?
Cheaper than Winchester white box 9mm from Wal-Mart?
Hell I'm missing out, give an old man a clue.
What caliber and where do you order your ammo from.
If I can feed a CZ cheaper then I will start looking around for one right away.

[Whiterook]

A CZ52 can be fed cheaper right now.

http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/7_62x25.html

It won't last forever, but it is so cheap you can stock up. Good aftermarket mags are available too.

[Dr. Foster]

Ruger MK II .22LR semi-auto pistola.

In addition to being small and lightweight, the .22LR round is one of the most common rounds available. You could carry thousands of rounds of spare ammo without compromising much space in your pack. and with a bolt on stock and scope it's also super accurate.

While I wouldn't really trust it for a full zombie siege. It would be great for killing rabbits and such for sustenance when I take to the Canadian wilderness.

[Dr. Foster]

...silver bullets with a silencer...

wait...why?

[mattifikation]

In case there's werewolves with the zombies?

[Trumble0]

I don't mind the looks of the CZ-52... I like the Looks of the Tokarev TT33 though. I would be happy with one.

[Tripoli]

"Beware of the man who shoots only one rifle - - He may know how to use it."

This was told this too many years ago and like HitMan, I believe “you can NEVER have too many guns”. This thread is talking about “One Gun” and it is a “Pistol” ONLY.

I don’t want to sound like a “gun snob” but if you are going to buy “One Gun” make sure it is of good quality. When the dead rise, there is not time to say, “Damn! Why won’t this thing shoot?”

High price does not equal high quality but cheep is cheep. Look at work horse revolvers or autos, buy a spare magazines every month (if you chose and auto) until you are happy with the amount and practice, practice, and practice.

[Darkness]

"This thread is for something often refered to as a 'side-arm'."

"That's a small handgun, that is carried in a pocket, pack or belt holster, that you carry as a dependable back-up weapon. Their purpose is for such things as hunting, scavenging, and incase that big gun, that you found on the dead soldier, runs out before you find more ammo."

"It is usually a decent caliber pistol, that is easy to maintain, easy to shoot, and uses a highly common ammo, that would be easy to find and light enough to carry a lot of." :)

[Bob]

Score for you.
That is a good price for ammunition.
I am going to look around for a pistol and get a couple of cans of that ammo before it dries up.


On the gun snob thing, I didn't mean to offend but some people just can't afford a real pistol. My first pistol other than a Crossman air gun was a Colt 1911 but I saved and searched till I found what I wanted. My second was a Smith Model 19 I traded into.

[bandits1]

Ruger MK II .22LR semi-auto pistola.

In addition to being small and lightweight, the .22LR round is one of the most common rounds available. You could carry thousands of rounds of spare ammo without compromising much space in your pack. and with a bolt on stock and scope it's also super accurate.

While I wouldn't really trust it for a full zombie siege. It would be great for killing rabbits and such for sustenance when I take to the Canadian wilderness.
That's what this thread is all about: the one-and-only weapon(has to be a handgun) you would choose to have during ZPAW. So choose one.

And could you explain why wouldn't you trust the Ruger MK II .22LR as your "One Gun"?

[bandits1]

"This thread is for something often refered to as a 'side-arm'."

"That's a small handgun, that is carried in a pocket, pack or belt holster, that you carry as a dependable back-up weapon. Their purpose it for such things as hunting, scavenging, and incase that big gun, that you found on the dead soldier, runs out before you find more ammo."

"It is usually a decent caliber pistol, that is easy to maintain, easy to shoot, and uses a highly common ammo, that would be easy to find and light enough to carry a lot of." :)
The OP states that in this scenario, your "sidearm" or "back-up weapon" is going to be the only firearm you will ever have.

If you could only cary one gun, a pistol, what would it be?

A pistol with spare ammo. thats it.

I would cary a 1911 with 7 7-round magazines. thats 49 rounds on hand with a spare for myself (if I need it)

you?
...so people need to take that into consideration when choosing their handgun. Nowhere does the OP state that this weapon will only be used on zombies -- it's going to be used on everything and everyone you may need to shoot at.

Anyone want to rethink their decision?

[Zombie Slayer]

Has anyone shot the P226 9mm? I have heard great things about this gun. I wouldn't mind something along the lines of this model, caliber since I already own a 9mm...but sadly (and ashamed) to admit that it is one of those god awful "ring of fire" crap pieces. I am more of a rifle man but decided to buy an inexpensive handgun to practice a little with and then move up to a better, more dependable make and model. I would choose the P226 9mm since I am more familiar with this caliber and the ammo would more than likely be more plentiful IMO, but I could be wrong since A LOT of other people would more than likely have 9mm's as well. :2cents:

[Tripoli]

The OP states that in this scenario, your "sidearm" or "back-up weapon" is going to be the only firearm you will ever have.


...so people need to take that into consideration when choosing their handgun. Nowhere does the OP state that this weapon will only be used on zombies -- it's going to be used on everything and everyone you may need to shoot at.

Anyone want to rethink their decision?

I am not understanding! The “One Gun”, per the OP:

“If you could only carry one gun, a pistol, what would it be?
A pistol with spare ammo. that’s it.” (I corrected the spelling)

The forum is “ALL THINGS ZOMBIE” and to talk about anything else is why this section, “Undead Survival & Defense “, of the forum was closed for over a year.

As far as the one gun goes, if the “One Gun” is good enough to score a brain shot on the undead, then it will be good enough to score a hit on the living. After all, why would you aim anywhere else than the head on Z-Day?

[Tripoli]

Has anyone shot the P226 9mm? I have heard great things about this gun. I wouldn't mind something along the lines of this model, caliber since I already own a 9mm...but sadly (and ashamed) to admit that it is one of those god awful "ring of fire" crap pieces. I am more of a rifle man but decided to buy an inexpensive handgun to practice a little with and then move up to a better, more dependable make and model. I would choose the P226 9mm since I am more familiar with this caliber and the ammo would more than likely be more plentiful IMO, but I could be wrong since A LOT of other people would more than likely have 9mm's as well. :2cents:

The Sig. P-226 is a fine weapon! You could do a lot worse than this handgun!

[Hitman]

Y'all are coming off as gun snobs.

If it's all someone can afford then I say go for it just shoot it enough to know what to expect and if it won't feed or eject then get rid of it and try something else.

Not everyone that needs or wants a pistol can afford one of the better ones.
It's easy to say I wouldn't have one of them there el-cheapo pieces of crap when you CAN afford a good pistol. To some people $150 is a lot of money.

I don't have a highpoint but I may have to get one just so I can do a range test and prove or disprove their reliability.

Feed a CZ cheaper?
Cheaper than Winchester white box 9mm from Wal-Mart?
Hell I'm missing out, give an old man a clue.
What caliber and where do you order your ammo from.
If I can feed a CZ cheaper then I will start looking around for one right away.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=111168385
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=110977034

I've seen both cheaper . I just happened to find these quickly.

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/browse/browseammo.aspx?c=95&s=987
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/browse/browseammo.aspx?c=95&s=952

I wasn't trying to be a snob. I just don't see what would make some one pick a high point over a CZ52 ( barrels can be swapped out for 9mm drop in barrels) . here is a good read on the pistols .

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu25.htm

[Bob]

Well I was proven wrong about pricing of ammunition for the CZ and am going to see about getting one and a couple of cans of ammo for it.

Thing I wonder about is what is the price of ammunition going to be like when the surplus dries up?
I can remember when a round common in surplus and commercial in this country (.308) was cheap to shoot, look at it now.
As long as a 9mm barrel is priced reasonably I guess it won't be a big deal.

That being said I still intend to get one, I am kind of out of touch on somethings especially the low end.

As far as why people would buy a Hi Point over a CZ it's probably because the Hi Point would be new and the CZ old furrin surplus in a weird caliber. They would not be able to brag to their friends that "I got me a Fotie / Nine / Fotie Five (did I misspell forty correctly?:roll: )

On the subject of Sig 226.
I am an oddball in that I don't much care for them.
I have a pair of Sigs, a 226 and a 220, I got the 226 as a part of a package deal on the two tone 220. I had decided I wanted a really high class double action pistol. I looked around and decided on a Sig. Well on the first trip to the range I knew I made a mistake, neither of them shoot well for me. I don't know if it is the grip angle or the trigger but they just don't hit where I point them. They shoot great for other people, my best friend is always hounding me to sell him the 226 and I probably would if it were not for the fact that my oldest son loves it too. Blood trumps friendship. A couple of months later I decided to buy a Glock to shut up a friend who I thought was the biggest Glock fan boy on the planet, I expected to hate it, I expected it to be a safe queen. Imagine my surprise when the damn thing hit where I pointed it every time right out of the box. I did a trigger job on it and changed out the sights and it just kept getting better. I liked it so much I gradually bought 4 more of them. I just use the factory sights now because my old eyes can't half see them anyway. I do modify them a bit (trigger jobs and such) but nothing that would effect the reliability in any way.

My point is try several before you decide which one to buy.
A gun your friend shoots one ragged hole with may not be the one for you. Don't go on appearance alone, Sigs have beautiful lines, fit, and finish while a Glock is all about function not looks.
(this is where I usually make sexist remarks but "deys wimmin folks about")

Really it's all about what works for you.

[Jimmy]

Anybody thinking about wasting their money on a Hi-point...DON'T. They are the cheapest pieces of junk on the market and you will regret buying it. I'm not a gunsnob, just warning my fellow Zombie enthusiasts about Hi-points. I don't want someone to rely on this weapon to save their life and end up getting killed just because they wanted to save a few bucks. I understand guns can be expensive but in the long run it's worth saving up a little more money and buying a Glock or something. They last FOREVER.

Just a couple days ago I saw a used Glock 22 40cal. in a gunstore for $320. >_>

[Bob]

Ya know the jury is still out as far as I am concerned on the Hi Point.
They get mixed reviews on the gun forums.
I know someone in Fl that just got one I will ask him if he has had any problems to date with it.

The cheapest used Glocks I have seen were police turn in model 22 for $299.
They were second generation and some of them looked really good.

I can't argue that getting a better pistol in the first place is really the way to go. But there is a big difference in $150 and 3-5 hundred. I say that not really knowing what Hi Points sell for around here. Just for grins I think I will look next week and see what else I can find on the shelf within a hundred extra.

[Tripoli]

'High price does not equal high quality but cheep is cheep. Look at work horse revolvers or autos, buy a spare magazines every month (if you chose and auto) until you are happy with the amount and practice, practice, and practice."

[mattifikation]

They get mixed reviews on the gun forums.

Exactly. I know you weren't trying to argue in favor of them, but I'm quoting you to make a point to anyone who's thinking about getting one: If you needed brain surgery, would you trust your life with a doctor who had "mixed reviews?"

If you need a gun to protect yourself - zombies or otherwise - then you shouldn't be trusting a Hi-Point with that. Pass on something else in your budget for a little while until you can afford, well, anything else. I hate to say it, after all my arguments earlier, but I'd even trust a .22 before I'd trust a Hi-Point. "Small Bang" > "No Bang"

If you're getting a gun for target shooting or whatever, then I'd still get something nicer. And if you're really that strapped for cash that you can't afford something nicer, why would you be wasting money on a range-only gun to begin with?

[Tripoli]

Exactly. I know you weren't trying to argue in favor of them, but I'm quoting you to make a point to anyone who's thinking about getting one: If you needed brain surgery, would you trust your life with a doctor who had "mixed reviews?"

If you need a gun to protect yourself - zombies or otherwise - then you shouldn't be trusting a Hi-Point with that. Pass on something else in your budget for a little while until you can afford, well, anything else. I hate to say it, after all my arguments earlier, but I'd even trust a .22 before I'd trust a Hi-Point. "Small Bang" > "No Bang"

If you're getting a gun for target shooting or whatever, then I'd still get something nicer. And if you're really that strapped for cash that you can't afford something nicer, why would you be wasting money on a range-only gun to begin with?


:clap::clap:I have to agree with you here!:clap::clap:

[Dave Of The Dead]

The only mixed reviews I see are from the people bashing the Hi-Point when they have never shot one before. I haven't read a testimony from someone who shot one and had something bad to say about it. Most it the flak comes from people who assume its a bad gun because of its price and looks. Not once in my reading reviews did I see someone say that it was jamming or not firing. I say people should have more of an open mind and not just think that price is everything.

[Bob]

Well all this being said I carry a Kel-Tec P3AT in my pocket every day of my life.
If I have pants on it is in my pocket.

It is not always about cost.

I have more to say on this subject but the dogs are demanding to be fed.

[Jimmy]

Our State certified Range Masters who instructed our class in the Police Academy said they are the crappiest guns on the market. For that reason, our department will NOT let us carry them even as a back-up weapon.

I assume there must be some reason all these experts with years of training and expirience have said these things about HiPoint....... -_-

Hell idk... To each his own.

[Whiterook]

For the record I don't think anyone on here is talking about HiPoints as an every day carry gun.

As for range plinking/hiking/camping guns? Sure, why not? I take Milsurps but if they aren't readily available in your area grab a Hi-Point.

My experience with Hi-Points has been pretty positive actually, the VAST majority of people who say they are junk never held one or fired one.

[Dave Of The Dead]

Our State certified Range Masters who instructed our class in the Police Academy said they are the crappiest guns on the market. For that reason, our department will NOT let us carry them even as a back-up weapon.

I assume there must be some reason all these experts with years of training and expirience have said these things about HiPoint....... -_-

Hell idk... To each his own.

Well yeah, I can definitely see their point. Officers really only use their weapons in a pinch when someone's life is in danger, correct? I definitely wouldn't bet someone's life against the cheapest gun on the market. But yeah, as a plinking, camping, and an everyday trunk gun, I would say someone would have no problems purchasing a cheap gun like the HiPoint

[Gummerfan]

If you NEED a gun, a HiPoint in your pocket beats an HK on layaway at the store.
No, I wouldn't recommend one as a primary defensive weapon. Same for the others of its ilk (Lorcin, Raven, et al).
If you're on a budget, you can find good deals on plenty of used, good quality revolvers. Taurus, Rossi, Charter Arms, all make dependable pieces. Buy one, maybe buy another later, and eventually you can do a trade for that Glock or 1911 or whatever.

[Bob]

Better a .380 in your pocket than a 10mm at home in the safe right?

One of the primary rules of carrying a gun is to always carry one.
A pocket pistol is better than a sharp stick or big rock neither of which you are going to find in a parking lot.

[Adam]

Hello All,

As much as I like my Ruger P95, if I could only carry ONE handgun,
it would have to be my Smith and Wesson Model 28 "Highway
Patrolman."

N-framed .357 Magnum goodness.:)

It will fire .38 Special in a pinch, also.

Of course, I'd have to steal it away from my Beloved, who considers
it "her" revolver; it resides in HER dresser drawer!

Watching a five-foot-tall woman shoot that hogleg always cracks me
up; she looks like a little kid shooting her daddy's gun.

[mattifikation]

Why yes, officer, I only own one gun. All the others were lost in a fire... yeah... that's it. And all the ones I've bought since then broke...

[Gummerfan]

Why yes, officer, I only own one gun. All the others were lost in a fire... yeah... that's it. And all the ones I've bought since then broke...:lol: "And since you're a fine, upstanding citizen with nothing to hide, you won't mind if we do a little search just to make sure, right?"
I got a new piece yesterday, but it's not an "evil" black semi-automatic hi-cap assault-looking weapon. Just a revolver. Well, just a Magnum Research BFR in 45-70 Government. No good for zombies, though. (unless they're standing single file and are all the same height). :)

[Darkness]

"Please keep politics out of the conversation. Thank you."

[BobZombie]

I have bad news for members of “All Things Zombie”! There is no such thing as ONE gun! Handgun, Rifle, and Shotgun are needed to combat the undead when they rise! Me I’ll take a combination of weapons:
1. Carbine/Rifle – needs to be something of common caliber & carried by law enforcement, military, and most of the public! (This means, 5.56 or 7.62 N.A.T.O.)
2. Shotgun = 12 or 20 gauge, it doesn’t matter. These are equally good gauges and can do the job when the dead rise. I will not talk about the commonality of the shells, as that does not matter, but I will talk about the penetration of the shot. These are equal! Sure the number of shot or weight is decreased but the penetration is the same!
3. Pistol = Revolver, semi autos are a bad choice. 1 a malfunction is deadly that cannot be recovered from! This post is about 1 handgun and it cannot be about 1 handgun. As the ball is in my court, I’ll take a S&W 650 & 651! These two are .22 magnums and to have only 1 handgun is stupid! I’ve read this before, pound for pound / grain for grain a .22 magnum is the most powerful pistol on the market! And in a pinch a .22 magnum can and has fired a .22lr. in a pinch!

[Darkness]

I have bad news for members of “All Things Zombie”! There is no such thing as ONE gun! Handgun, Rifle, and Shotgun are needed to combat the undead when they rise!

"If you wish to talk about multiple guns, we have threads for that. This thread is about that trusty pocket/boot/pack/holster pistol."

[bandits1]

I suppose if I had to carry a revolver as my "one gun", I'd probably choose this one:

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5332/dsc07764vf7.jpghttp://img508.imageshack.us/img508/518/popwm961837ou3.jpg

...Smith & Wesson Performance Center Model 327 Tactical Rail Revolver in .357 Magnum. Eight-shot capacity and a tactical rail for a weapon light, which I think is almost manditory in a ZPAW enviroment where electrical service may a bit on the spotty side.

[Tripoli]

3. Pistol = Revolver, semi autos are a bad choice. 1 a malfunction is deadly that cannot be recovered from! This post is about 1 handgun and it cannot be about 1 handgun. As the ball is in my court, I’ll take a S&W 650 & 651! These two are .22 magnums and to have only 1 handgun is stupid! I’ve read this before, pound for pound / grain for grain a .22 magnum is the most powerful pistol on the market! And in a pinch a .22 magnum can and has fired a .22lr. in a pinch!

Smith & Wesson Model 650 & 651 could be a good choice for Z-day. The .22 WMR ammunition is light and powerful. Copper jacketed vs. copper coated the round offers an advantage to penetration and range. These pistols are not cheep and neither is the ammunition but they are reliable and accurate. The .22 WRF cartridge is also interchangeable with rifles and carbines and with the longer barrels comes more power and extended range. Good selection!

[Gummerfan]

I suppose if I had to carry a revolver as my "one gun", I'd probably choose this one:
...Smith & Wesson Performance Center Model 327 Tactical Rail Revolver in .357 Magnum. Eight-shot capacity and a tactical rail for a weapon light, which I think is almost manditory in a ZPAW enviroment where electrical service may a bit on the spotty side.

Hard to argue with that one.

[Darkness]

I suppose if I had to carry a revolver as my "one gun", I'd probably choose this one:

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5332/dsc07764vf7.jpghttp://img508.imageshack.us/img508/518/popwm961837ou3.jpg

...Smith & Wesson Performance Center Model 327 Tactical Rail Revolver in .357 Magnum. Eight-shot capacity and a tactical rail for a weapon light, which I think is almost manditory in a ZPAW enviroment where electrical service may a bit on the spotty side.

"Nice looking handgun." :)

[JakAttak]

That gun is dead sexy

[Bob]

One of the senior VP's where I work has one of those.
He had to send it back, evidently it was not test fired when it was in the CUSTOM SHOP.
The firing pin was not making good enough contact with the primers to ensure reliable operation.

[stonyman65]

You know I started this post about 3 months ago... To this day, people still do not get the point. I made it so people would THINK about this. not just say "One gun, I'll take a .50 Cal!" it's stupid and not practical. The original meaning of this post was this:

Due to some unknown situation, you can only carry one handgun

My god, I never thought it would be this hard. we've gone off topic like what, six, maybe seven times now. WTF.

It also just occurred to me that some of you know nothing about firearms other than what you've seen on TV or in video games...

I'm just as stupid for making this thread.
Okay, my bitching is over. :evil:

[stonyman65]

I suppose if I had to carry a revolver as my "one gun", I'd probably choose this one:

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5332/dsc07764vf7.jpghttp://img508.imageshack.us/img508/518/popwm961837ou3.jpg

...Smith & Wesson Performance Center Model 327 Tactical Rail Revolver in .357 Magnum. Eight-shot capacity and a tactical rail for a weapon light, which I think is almost manditory in a ZPAW enviroment where electrical service may a bit on the spotty side.

Ah, the Smith and Wesson Nite-Tac series. that was made in cooperation with Thunder Ranch. Clint sure knows what he is doing! Great pistol. A little bulky, but I wouldn't mind using that.

[Bob]

Different is not always better.

[killnburn]

if i had to take one pistol as my only weapons, as a primary, i would go with the HK Mark 23, why? because its reliable and extremely accurate,

look at that part of an article:

In more than 450 accuracy test firings from a precision firing fixture, MK 23 pistols far exceeded the government requirement, averaging 1.44 inches, with 65 groups of less than one inch. There were four groups of .5 inches, with 5 rounds going through the same hole! This included firing with and without the sound/flash suppressor attached. Three pistols were tested for accuracy after firing over 30,000 rounds, the specified service life of the pistol,

these test were made at 25meters, a pretty good engagement range for zeds

same article about reliability:

To meet the reliability requirement, the pistol had to demonstrate a minimum of 2,000 mean rounds between stoppages (MRBS) with both M1911 ball and +P ammunition. All pistols exceeded the 2000 MRBS with an average of 6000 MRBS.


that is 6000 rounds before a stoppage, its incredible! for those who say that revolver is way more reliable, you will probably never fire that many round during the zombie apocalypse, you also have a rail for accesories like the LAM that includes a laser and a flashlight, for quick follow up shots, you have a recoil reducing system that makes 30% less recoil


yes its heavy but if its my main gun, loaded its still lighter than the lightest m4!

[50 cal]

The HK 23 SOCOM is a good accurate pistol. A bit on the weighty side though. I wouldn't turn one away if it came into my hands.
I fired one with a suppressor on it. Extremely quiet. The can would be a nice addition to your gear.

I would still rather have a Glock 17 or Beretta 92fs for the mag capacity. Supressors can be fitted either also. Been thinking of a can for my Glock 17 for some time now.

[VideoJunkie]

The numbers don't lie, and the amount of ammo you could carry certainly make the 22 seem like an ideal choice. But it's not for me. I just can't see a 22 as a primary weapon. I'd have to go with a 9mm. It's a nice compromise on size/weight and functionality. It's sort of a best of both worlds thing. Rounds are small/light enough to allow LOT's of spare ammo, (compared to .45 cal) but it's still got plenty of punch. Maybe some of this is psychological. It doesn't really matter. The point is I just feel better with a 9mm. Specifically, I'd take a Sig 226. I swear that gun seems made for my hand. It's the gun I feel most comfortable shooting and with which I have the best results. Look, I'm no uber-marksman. I certainly couldn't hit 4 out of 6 targets at 100 yards, ESPECIALLY with a snub nose 5 SHOT revolver.:loon: I haven't perfected either my shooting or my MATH to that level. Skill like that is indeed rare. The fact is I don't get to the range often enough. Having admitted that, I'm still a better than average shot. I can reliably empty my Taurus PT-111 into Zacks rotting skull (head on a B-27 SILHOUETTE) at 7 yards, and at ten yards I might have one shot a little off the mark. With the Sig, though, I look like I actually know what I'm doing. For whatever reason, the gun just works for me. That's why it's my choice for my "One Gun". It's not the newest, or the fanciest. It doesn't make the biggest hole or let you carry thousands of rounds of ammo. What it DOES do is this...it puts holes where I want them. Reliably, with no noticeable recoil and with larger mags than my 10+1 shot PT-111. It's the gun I'd want if Zack was coming down the street because it works FOR ME. And isn't that what this Thread is supposed to be about?

[Jester]

^^^

Have to agree with this guy about the 9mm round.


Id take that over a 22 any day


However as far as the gun goes i think i would go with an m9


Insanely large clip


And its power is low enough to where my rounds aren't gunna go through some paper thin wall and hit a survivor on the other side, yet still powerful enough to bust open zacks skull with ease.

Also it is rather light, which helps a lot in sighting.


Me and my dad had quite a discussion about pistols when he bought his, as he is an expert marksman (like...military marksman certificate and all) and he said weight is a big problem in handguns, the main reason desert eagles are almost never used in real world militaries.

However he took an incredibly tiny glock.....

Oh well

m9 for me

[detpat]

consider a springer xd in 45acp, good weight and 13 rounds of 45. or also the new xdm model in 9mm, 20 rounds of 9mm para.

glock 17 with 33 round g18 mags.

[Bob]

Well VJ I have seen you shoot.
Matter of fact I am going to the range today, want to go?

Anyway to get back on target err uh I meant topic...

Personally I like the Glock 17, one of the neat things about it is the 33 round magazines. If I could have a second gun it would be another G17.

One thing I have noticed regarding rifles is in close urban encounters with Z they tend to be grab targets. Once Zack latches on it if there is more than one you might as well let go and reach for a sidearm or a big stick or whatever. Emulate the close control stance that police use, there is reason for it.

[detpat]

bayonets! or give the barrel a quick twist down and inside, this will break the zeds grip. or bayonets!

[Bob]

Bayonets on a pistol?
Besides I don't think normal bayonet drills will have much effect on a Zed.

[VideoJunkie]

Bayonet Drills? What kind of batteries do Bayonet Drills use. Got to have a Bayonet Drill on my PT111!!! I'm thinking 1700 rpm with about an 18 inch blade!! Can you say SplatterFest?!?!

yeah, I know...I got issues...:loon:

[Lian]

Personally I think bayonets are just fail to begin with. Throws off the balance on most guns so it's harder to make long shots. That and with so many things being made out of plastic, or just being so damn pick you don't want to use it as a club to begin with. :roll:

[Bob]

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/4505/d645920e395fedalog9.jpg

[detpat]

i wasn't suggesting bayonets on pistols, but that hideous cz thing might actually be useful for a change. most bayonet techniques aren't gonna destroy a zed, i would sure as hell rather stab a zed in the skull with a bayonet than just a bare muzzle. a sharp bayonet is gonna be more useful cutting away grasping hands or chasing feet or tendons than your Swiss army knife!

most folks i see criticizing bayonets have never used one. try it, you'll like it!

[Bob]

I know you weren't I was just pranking around.

I don't think a bayonet is really a good way to go against Zeds though.

I would rather have a pistol in a close retention grip that they never manage to grasp, than use a bayonet to cut them loose from the rifle they managed to latch onto.

I guess my point is they have no fear of being shot, cut, or stabbed.
They would literally grab the bayonet, losing fingers in the process perhaps but it would impede you, perhaps enough for a second Zed to actually grab you.

So we are back to me thinking a high capacity, low recoil, pistol is the way to go in close quarters.

[DevilsRain]

JV, we all know who your BGF is. Now, we all know who is the catcher and who is the pitcher in your relationship! VJ & Bob show is on. Seriously silly boys, you two should get a room and leave us alone.

[detpat]

i think the pistol is a great idea, i just think that the old maxim about a pistol being what you use to fight your way to your rifle is true. a bayonet is what you have to keep the zeds off your rifle. it doesn't matter if they fear it or not, they don't fear getting shot either. most military rifles are designed to shoot with it mounted anyway.

I'm not suggesting you fix your pigsticker and throw away your ammo!

[Augustus Desius]

I know you weren't I was just pranking around.

I don't think a bayonet is really a good way to go against Zeds though.

I would rather have a pistol in a close retention grip that they never manage to grasp, than use a bayonet to cut them loose from the rifle they managed to latch onto.

I guess my point is they have no fear of being shot, cut, or stabbed.
They would literally grab the bayonet, losing fingers in the process perhaps but it would impede you, perhaps enough for a second Zed to actually grab you.

So we are back to me thinking a high capacity, low recoil, pistol is the way to go in close quarters.

I don't really see why a zed would grab at a bayonet. I can see the bayonet getting stuck into a zed, as it maybe too close to pull the rifle back without exposing your vitals, or perhaps it would get stuck in the zeds clothing or organs. But I don't see them grabbing at it for any reason.

The gun your making me think of (due to my rather shallow knowledge on the area) is the FiveseveN. I love that gun. I agree that this type of pistol is a great weapon for Z-Day.

[Darkness]

JV, we all know who your BGF is. Now, we all know who is the catcher and who is the pitcher in your relationship! VJ & Bob show is on. Seriously silly boys, you two should get a room and leave us alone.

"DevilsRain, this comment was unesessary, and uncalled for. Please keep such personal comments to yourself, or take it to PM. This is not the place for it." :naughty:




"Now lets get back to the proper topic. Thank you."

[detpat]

when i first saw one i wanted it as a collectible because i thought it wouldn't last long. I was, of course, wrong. i think you would have to drastically modiry your gun handling techniques for the bayonet pistol to avoid sticking yourself with a contaminated bayonet while trying to re holster under stress.

on a rifle or shottie on the other hand, it's an excellent idea. if you can at least save one round as the classic way to free a bayonet is to fire a round.

sometimes a bayonet is used when at close quarters and firing a round is unsafe due to friendly fire issues. I'd rather have it and never use it than not have the option.

[Bob]

Devils Rain

BGF????
Sorry I don't recognize that acronym.

Pitcher and Catcher?
I have not been involved with baseball since my youngest son got out of high school a few years ago. I never was all than involved in the first place, my arthritis kept me from seriously helping him practice. I wished I had started my second family earlier so I could have been in better shape to participate in "Dad" stuff with the boys. I had to push really hard to do as much as I did, they never knew how much pain I was in.

[Bob]

Augustus Desius

Using the movies as a guide they are going to grab at anything in range.
This would include the bayonet, the shamblers tend to not be coordinated enough to not grab the blade occasionally.

I don't care for the five seven, the ammunition is to uncommon.
That and the only person I ever encountered with one was an arrogant sob.


detpat

The pistol bayonet was intended to be a joke.

[detpat]

i understand about the joke, i was just preaching to the choir so to speak.

I would rather they grab the bayonet than the rifle. grabbing a bayonet will forfeit fingers!

on the FN pistol, without the AP ammo it's just a .22 mag, for all intents. not really a worthwhile proposition for defense at all. the new XDM in 9mm is gonna have a 20 round mag so it's not even a real standout in that department either.

[Bob]

10-4
Did not mean anything by the statement.
It's just on some of the other forums I am on some of my humor tends to fly right over the heads of the members.

I really believe the Glock 17 is the way to go.
The 33 round magazines for the Glock 17 don't stick out as far as one might think.

I only have 4 of them at the moment and am thinking I might better get a few more before the election.
If high cap magazines are permanently banned they will eventually be worth an amazing amount of money.
Just look what happened to full auto stuff, when the restriction was put in place in 1985 saying no more for the civilian population after this date it wasn't a big deal that year or the next few but now the prices are crazy.

[detpat]

i was a housing cop during the ban and i know guys that paid $85 for glock 23 mags. I agree with you as i have a storm lake conversion barrel for my g22 and g17 mags to go along with it. I'm gonna pick up a 22 conversion as well and maximize my versatility. I also have scherer 33 round mags for my g22 and KT sub 2000 in .40, i had to go through a major PIA to get a load out tha are all reliable.

My next item on the list is either a 5.45 ar upper or a g17 sub 2000 to make best use of the 9mm mags. the sub is reall only an extended pistol and a niche item due to the folding nature of the arm. other non folding pistol caliber carbines have no interest for me.

[VideoJunkie]

Here's a question for everyone. Does your choice for your 'one gun' depend on the type of zombie you'd be facing. I chose a Sig 9mm w/ 15 round clips. That was based on the standard slow moving 'Shamblers'. Now I'm thinking that if we were faced with the much faster and more coordinated 'Rage' type of zombies, I might feel differently. 16 rounds seems like alot for slow movers, but fast walking or, God forbid, running zombies... I don't know. What is the largest ammo capacity available in a 9mm handgun. I don't want to start the whole debate about .22's again. I'm just asking for myself, and I feel more comfortable with the 9mm. Thanks.

[BobZombie]

Good question. First things first, “Rage type of zombies” aren’t zombies. 1, no head shot required. 2, they can starve to death. 3, they feel pain. 4, they have a higher level of consciousness (think & reason). This is why it is called a “Rage Virus” not a zombie rage virus.

Enough with the splitting of hairs. Zombies, like in Dawn of the Dead (remake) were fast and agile. 1, head shots only need apply. A 9mm is fine for this job and if you can’t take out 2 or 3 zombies with 15 or 16 rounds maybe you shouldn’t go out after dark.

This being said, “One Gun” is “If you could only carry one gun, a pistol, what would it be?” S & W Model 651 .22 magnum (WMR).

Calico M-950 - 100 round capacity (9mm) is the highest capacity handgun I know of.

I almost forgot, PP-19 Bizon with 64 rounds cylindrical magazine in 9x18mm’ 7,62x25mm Tokarev; 9x19mm Luger / Parabellum This is in semi-auto now too, but only close to a hand gun in MHO.

[Bob]

Maybe what we need is a thread where people list the pistol and rifle they would carry. One entry for stuff you have and one entry for wish list stuff.

No chit chat, just list the items.
Then someone (not me) could compile a list and we could look to see how many choose what gun and caliber.

[detpat]

good luck getting that bison imported.

[Hitman]

9mm ar pistols have a 32 rd mag and I beleve 100rd beta mags
HK sp89 pistols have 30 rds and 100rd beta mags
specter pistols had 50rd mags
M11 pistols with sten mag wells can use 50rd lanchaster mags

I've seen sumoi (sp?) drums modded for a few pistols over the years (72 rds + -)

[Fierce_Track]

A Desert Eagle. Definately.

[Bob]

A Desert Eagle. Definately.

Oh so you can penetrate the skull of the army zeds who still have their helmets on?

[Dave Of The Dead]

the DEagle is for those pesky zeds hiding behind a brick wall. :roll:

[Gummerfan]

A Desert Eagle. Definately.
I like big guns.
I like magnum handguns.
I like automatics.
I can't stand the Deagles.
I've tried really hard to MAKE myself like the Deagles, but I just can't.
They're way too big, too heavy, and super-slow to bring into action. I've handled bricks that have better ergonomics. Every time I think about getting one, I go to the store and pick one up, rack the slide, try to disengage the safety with one hand, and change my mind pretty quick.
For an offensive gun, they may be okay, but for a defensive sidearm, they just plain suck.

[Gummerfan]

the DEagle is for those pesky zeds hiding behind a brick wall. :roll:
That's what my 45-70 BFR is for.:lol:
But, if I'm limited to one handgun, it'll be staying home.

[Bob]

How many times do I have to say "High Capacity, Low Recoil"?

[Gummerfan]

M11 pistols with sten mag wells can use 50rd lanchaster mags

Groovy! Know where I can get some? I've got a pair of MPA "Macs" on the way. 1 in .45 that uses M3 Greasegun mags and a 9mm that uses the Sten mags.

[VideoJunkie]

How many times do I have to say "High Capacity, Low Recoil"?

Ok, then you can use my Daisy single pump BB gun. No recoil at all, and it'll hold like a thousand BB's! Of course, that might be going to extremes...

[Gummerfan]

You could shoot an eye out...:lol:

[detpat]

SA macs are amusing toys but little else.

[Hitman]

Groovy! Know where I can get some? I've got a pair of MPA "Macs" on the way. 1 in .45 that uses M3 Greasegun mags and a 9mm that uses the Sten mags.

not for a good price. my M11/9 uses sten mags .

I picked up a ton of sten mags from tactical inovatins a couple of years back. they have gone up in price quite a bit .

http://www.tacticalinc.com/sten-mags-surplus-p-256.html

[Gummerfan]

Here's another source:
http://www.ima-usa.com/product_info.php/products_id/94
And yeah, the Macs are just for fun. The FA SMGs aren't all that great either.
I'm just getting these since they're probably going to be banned.
Plus, I've been having 80's flashbacks lately.

[Hitman]

stock they do kinda suck. the guy I bought mine from had his set up for subgun matches. did pretty well from looking at the results of some of the matches he was in. the lage maxx upper is a way to totaly change the nature of the gun. get them down to 600rpm and put a good barrel in it is the main thing.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i277/bobsboobs/m11task.jpg


a friend just bought a MPA 9mm . I agree , range toy , not much else. I have 33 rd mags for my G19 and it has less muzzle flip to boot. not to mention its way smaller and much lighter.

[Gummerfan]

Neato. Yeah, that cyclic rate on the stock SMGs is ridiculously high. I thought about SBRing mine, but I don't think it's worth the trouble.
As you said, there's nothing they can do that can't be done just as well (or better) and more efficiently with a handgun.
In fact, subguns themselves are pretty much on the way out, being replaced by carbines, handguns and SBRs.
The fun thing about the semi-Macs (MPAs in particular) is that they're built to bumpfire. (hence their trigger slap!)

[detpat]

i had a cobray S/A a few years ago and traded it of for a AR carbine and a load of mags and accessories, the guy just HAD to have it. i think i got the better end of the deal evan though it had mags and a fake can and barrel extension.

[homelitexl]

:poo: i would want a fifty caliber revolver take out every thing for a mile in one shot:poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo:: poo:

[MacSupreMe]

Any gun that has the least chances of jamming... That being said, probably a compound bow

[detpat]

any proven modern design is gonna be fine, learn failure drills.

[Dave Of The Dead]

most jams in modern guns are easy to fix, especially in handguns. My .308 jams all the time, but thats mostly because its not broken in yet. All you have to do is pull the slide back and the jammed casing pops right out.

[DrDead]

Actually, the reason the gun jams is due to the fact that youre not holding a tight enough grip, not because its new. Try holding it tightly, and remember to employ the "tap rack bang" technique to clear it. When you go bang bang and then hear a click, it could be that the round is jammed in the mag or got jammed in the chamber. If you tap the mag firmly with the palm of the other hand and then rack it hard you can clear most jams quickly and keep on firing.

But I digress - back to the original topic. First, a .22 calibur pistol won't penetrate the skull in most instances and shouldn't be relied upon. Second, using a desert eagle .50 cal or a .44 magnum sounds sexy, but shooting it would leave you deaf and blind afterwards and has a huge recoil and are heavy to carry. Besides, you don't need to "tear the zed's head clean off the shoulders" to be effective. Third, I wouldn't choose a revolver, since they only shoot six and take longer to reload. Sure there are autoloaders, but they are still clumsy. They do jam less, however, but most are single action and have tight trigger pull. Fourth, I wouldn't choose a pistol with a safety, such as the CZ, sig, etc. When a zed is charging full speed and you raise your weapon, you don't want to pull the trigger and not have anything happen. Unless you've fired it a million times, you would have to take your eyes off the target and click the safety off. Plus, the next idiot that picks it up and needs to use it to save you might not understand the safety.

All this being said, you can't beat a glock 19. Clips hold 14 .9mm rounds each, and you can easily carry a dozen pre-loaded clips that take less than 3 seconds to change. Its a true double action, meaning that the trigger pull on shot number one is the same as number two, about 7 pounds, which helps first shot accuracy. Guns that are single action double action have a 12 pound trigger pull on shot one and 7 thereafter. The glock has no safety - Its literally point and shoot. Third, its compact and can be carried easily in a holster. Fourth, its a .9mm, which WILL penetrate the skull, and with hollow points, which is the only ammo you would use, would muck up a brain in a hurry without leaving you deaf and blind from the muzzleblast. Fifth, they are almost industructable and can be used nicely as a blunt weapon if needed.

Glock, its whats for zombie.

Drd

[DrDead]

i think the pistol is a great idea, i just think that the old maxim about a pistol being what you use to fight your way to your rifle is true. a bayonet is what you have to keep the zeds off your rifle. it doesn't matter if they fear it or not, they don't fear getting shot either. most military rifles are designed to shoot with it mounted anyway.

I'm not suggesting you fix your pigsticker and throw away your ammo!

I tend to disagree with the rifle comment. What do you do when one of them grabs the barrel of the rifle and wont let go? You shoot it in the chest five times and nothing happens. You break your arm and can't use it, then what? I'm in and out with a handgun, with right or left hand, close range or far, less bulk to grab.

WRT the long diatribe on capacity, I can swap out a mag in 2 seconds so I don't understand the need to carry 100 round mags that weigh you down considerably. Remember, shooting it accurately is the most important component of the head shot.

Drdead

[kiltedninja]

Springfield Armory .45 ACP. I'd get two spare mags for it, giving me a total of 42 rounds, and I'd carry spare ammo on hand.

[Dave Of The Dead]

DrDead, the jam I was talking about with the .308 was a stovepipe jam. That isn't exactly fixed by holding the gun tighter.

[Darkness]

DrDead, the jam I was talking about with the .308 was a stovepipe jam. That isn't exactly fixed by holding the gun tighter.

"That's a bullet that's jammed/stuck in the barrel of the gun, right?"

[CAVU45]

"That's a bullet that's jammed/stuck in the barrel of the gun, right?"

A stovepipe jam is the cartridge standing upright in the receiver with the bolt hitting the side of the case. It resembles a chimney pipe or stovepipe hence the name.

[the_velociraptor]

:poo: i would want a fifty caliber revolver take out every thing for a mile in one shot:poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo::poo:: poo:

I hope you're trolling...

[Darkness]

A stovepipe jam is the cartridge standing upright in the receiver with the bolt hitting the side of the case. It resembles a chimney pipe or stovepipe hence the name.

"Thank you." :)

[CAVU45]

"Thank you." :)


No worries! Happy to help. It's also reffered to as a smokestack jam. I almost forgot about that one.

[Nameless1]

I'm thinking either a 9mm or a 357, a 9 because the ammo is light and the one I have is easy to field strip. The 357 on the other hand has a lot o' knock down power and it can chamber .38 rounds. Being a revolver is also a plus when cleaning.

[phatpete]

definitley robocop's gun. i believe he never has to reload.

quite useful

[Darkness]

definitley robocop's gun. i believe he never has to reload.

quite useful

"Talk about fantasy weapons is in this other thread....."
http://www.allthingszombie.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16748
"This one is for talk about real pistols."

[phatpete]

in that case 357 mangum, if i need more than 6-8 bullets to solve the situation im in i would hope i have something besides pistol

[CAVU45]

Make mine the old reliable Colt 1911A1. It's simple to operate and field strip. Parts are readily available. Ammunition is plentiful.
I'm surprised at the number of people who chose "bad ass" guns like the Desert Eagle or a .44mag. In a real fight those guns would be nearly useless. In truth a real honest to God bad ass wouldn't carry either of those.

[mattifikation]

Well. I wouldn't carry those overly big rounds either, but they offer some advantages. Such as being more useful as hunting rounds on big game...

[CAVU45]

Well. I wouldn't carry those overly big rounds either, but they offer some advantages. Such as being more useful as hunting rounds on big game...


True enough. The question to ask then is, do the advantages outweigh the drawbacks? IMHO they don't. I can carry alot more ammunition with my .45ACP pistol and trap game. It's much quieter and saves the pounding those mega cartridges dish out. Plus my .45ACP is faster on the follow-up shot if needed.

[Gummerfan]

True enough. The question to ask then is, do the advantages outweigh the drawbacks? IMHO they don't. I can carry alot more ammunition with my .45ACP pistol and trap game. It's much quieter and saves the pounding those mega cartridges dish out. Plus my .45ACP is faster on the follow-up shot if needed.
C'mon, there isn't THAT much weight difference between .45ACP and the revolver ammo.(and you HAVE to have mags for the autos, you can get by without speedloaders for revolvers) Plus, both the .357 and .44mags can be downloaded with "specials" or just lighter-loaded "magnum" ammo.
I wouldn't hesitate to pack my .45 in most scenarios, but if I were limited to only ONE gun, that had to be a HANDGUN, that had to do EVERYTHING, I'd rather carry a .44mag. It just offers so much flexibility.

[DrDead]

DrDead, the jam I was talking about with the .308 was a stovepipe jam. That isn't exactly fixed by holding the gun tighter.

Wrong. Its either a recoil spring thats too tight or youre limp wristing your shots. Odds are the latter. Try locking your elbow and gripping your gun tighter, it should solve the problem. Even with the stove pipe jam, you still tap rack bang it like I was saying before.

Hope that helps!

Drdead

[Zompocalypse]

First, a .22 calibur pistol won't penetrate the skull in most instances and shouldn't be relied upon.

The .22 Long Rifle is used in a wide variety of revolvers, semi-automatics, and even derringers and single-shot target pistols. The .22 Long Rifle is not terribly effective as a handgun cartridge, since it needs a rifle-length barrel to get up to full speed; still, a lot of people are killed by .22 pistols every year.

I think a positive aspect of the .22 LR is that it will bounce around in the skull of a zombie. This is not an urban legend, according to Dr. Baden when he was asked,

“Can bullets ricochet inside a person's skull?

Yes. It's been reported -- and I've seen a number of cases -- where a bullet enters the skull and strikes the back part of the skull, but instead of going through the skull, it strikes the bone at a very sharp angle and ricochets. Then the bullet continues around the inside of the skull. This does happen… It usually happens with smaller caliber bullets, like twenty-two caliber bullets. Most bullets, ninety-eight percent of the time, go in a straight line.
And even when the bullet strikes bone it can be deflected a little bit, but not very much. Not all skulls are the same hardness and thickness; some skulls are an eighth of an inch thick, some are a half an inch thick. And that has an effect on the bullet's path. The thicker the skull, the more likely the will strike the bone and go off at a tangent, almost going three hundred and sixty degrees around the inside of the skull. “

:lol:

[CAVU45]

C'mon, there isn't THAT much weight difference between .45ACP and the revolver ammo.(and you HAVE to have mags for the autos, you can get by without speedloaders for revolvers) Plus, both the .357 and .44mags can be downloaded with "specials" or just lighter-loaded "magnum" ammo.
I wouldn't hesitate to pack my .45 in most scenarios, but if I were limited to only ONE gun, that had to be a HANDGUN, that had to do EVERYTHING, I'd rather carry a .44mag. It just offers so much flexibility.

I'll concede that the .44 and .357 are versatile in that other loads and even calibers can be used. That's a definate plus. But the ammo is larger, especially the .44, than the .45ACP and face it, not many people will be able to handle the hammering and weight of a .44mag or even the .357mag. I've not met an adult yet who couldn't fire the 1911 comfortably. Plus with speedloaders the revolvers are bulky and without speedloaders slow to reload. The 1911 mags are slim, light and make it easy to reload the pistol. Like I posted earlier, it's a tradeoff and each person will have to make up their own mind what is acceptable to them. As for me, I'll trust my 1911A1.

[CAVU45]

The .22 Long Rifle is used in a wide variety of revolvers, semi-automatics, and even derringers and single-shot target pistols. The .22 Long Rifle is not terribly effective as a handgun cartridge, since it needs a rifle-length barrel to get up to full speed; still, a lot of people are killed by .22 pistols every year.

I think a positive aspect of the .22 LR is that it will bounce around in the skull of a zombie. This is not an urban legend, according to Dr. Baden when he was asked,

“Can bullets ricochet inside a person's skull?

Yes. It's been reported -- and I've seen a number of cases -- where a bullet enters the skull and strikes the back part of the skull, but instead of going through the skull, it strikes the bone at a very sharp angle and ricochets. Then the bullet continues around the inside of the skull. This does happen… It usually happens with smaller caliber bullets, like twenty-two caliber bullets. Most bullets, ninety-eight percent of the time, go in a straight line.
And even when the bullet strikes bone it can be deflected a little bit, but not very much. Not all skulls are the same hardness and thickness; some skulls are an eighth of an inch thick, some are a half an inch thick. And that has an effect on the bullet's path. The thicker the skull, the more likely the will strike the bone and go off at a tangent, almost going three hundred and sixty degrees around the inside of the skull. “

:lol:

Problem being to get that .22 to penetrate a skull would require one to be uncomfortably close to the intended target thereby negating the value a firearm brings to the fight. In that case one might as well use a baseball bat.

[Gummerfan]

Like I posted earlier, it's a tradeoff and each person will have to make up their own mind what is acceptable to them.
Aye, there's the rub.:lol:Any firearm, whether a rifle, shotgun, antiaircraft cannon or SMG is a compromise in one way or another, even more so if we're limited to strictly one handgun.

[CAVU45]

Aye, there's the rub.:lol:Any firearm, whether a rifle, shotgun, antiaircraft cannon or SMG is a compromise in one way or another, even more so if we're limited to strictly one handgun.


Yep. Six of one, half dozen of another. I guess each person needs to think about what they want a firearm to do for them and choose accordingly understanding that there is no "best for everything" gun. Just like anything else, if it's built to do everything it'll do nothing well.

[Zompocalypse]

Problem being to get that .22 to penetrate a skull would require one to be uncomfortably close to the intended target thereby negating the value a firearm brings to the fight. In that case one might as well use a baseball bat.

There is nothing new here. A .22 Long Rifle is more than capable when it comes to penetrating the zombie skull. The best way to insure this penetration is to buy or cache quality ammunition. Personally, hyper velocity .22 LR is way underestimated and some brands offer better K.E. than others. A well made .22 pistol with a 6 inch barrel will do the job out to 30 yards or more. I would prefer a rifle with a barrel 18 inches or longer but that is not what this post is about.

To be honest, as far as one gun goes, I’d take a .22 WMR - - Ruger, Smith, Colt, or Taurus would do the job. I like a wheel gun, chances of a malfunction is almost ZERO and with very lil training anyone can learn how to use a revolver and hit their target with consistency. "I like the Trooper and Smith"

[Krazymouse]

a revolver is just like reloading a shotgun though. And its not as useful. A regular pistol would work. If you are scared it will malfunction, bring a spare along. I highly doubt pistols would malfunction twice in a row.

[mattifikation]

Revolvers are almost impossible to silence. They also offer very low ammo capacity, which entirely negates any reason you once had for limiting yourself to .22.

If you're going to get a revolver anyways, you might as well grab a .357. It'll shoot both .357 and .38 caliber ammunition, so you're more likely to find something you can use.

[Leeboy]

I'd go for a .380.