Beyond survival: Taking the fight to Zed

[Faran Brigo]

We've discussed a lot about survival plans, weaponry, the importance of picking a good hiding place and having a good bugout bag and vehicle. That's all well and good and extremely important, sure, but what about after?

Sure, you've survived the first six-twelve months of the zombie apocalypse, the stenches badly outnumber the living, and although you've carved out a living for yourself, and maybe a smallish group of people, what now?

I for one would not like to live out the rest of my days in hiding, cowering and hoping I live long enough for the zombies to rot. For all we know, it might take decades. In a real scenario, where the undead have taken my previous life away, with loved ones and family too probably, as soon as I was no longer scared witless, the one thing I would like would be revenge: to get back on the offensive.

So on that note, anyone got any bright ideas? what would be necesary to have before going on the offensive? what kind of resources? how many people? what about tactics and strategy? etc. etc.

[stonyman65]

If I stayed alive that long, I don't know what I would do. By then, I'd probobly be just asking to die, with no one around.

I would just fight. when I run out of bullets, id use a knife or a bat or something.

"If I'm going down, your all coming with me"

[AN OLD SHOE]

explosives....get as many zombies you can into a hot zone and blow them up...then stab or bash the remainig few....

[detpat]

screw retail, I'd go wholesale. Truck with a snowplow, preferably a state snow plow truck, the biggest one i can find and go play zedhockey.

[AN OLD SHOE]

sounds good...

why do that when you can get one of those huge farm truck things that is like 50 feet across with shredders....that would be bloody fun

[DarthJoe8]

Front end loader.:drinking:Zombie smash and scoop.:drinking:

Cool thread FB interesting thought.:think:

[AN OLD SHOE]

a great tactic would be to block off all roads and exits to a city..and just burn down the city...

[Faran Brigo]

I've had the same idea, but I'm concerned about the loss of potential survivors, supplies and viable buildings. In some cases though, like New York city or other cities with huge skyscrapers and underground networks, I think whatever you could find of value in the city is not worth fighting through the urban mess.

[detpat]

too much good stuff to just burn up.

where are you gonna drive a 50ft wide truck?

[Faran Brigo]

Like I said, valuable supplies. I think that needs to be dealt with on a case by case basis, with some careful consideration about the possibility for the fires to get out of hand, and the value of the supplies that might be there vs. the threat of the masses of the hungry undead.

If it's burbland with areas that serve as natural firebreaks and you're positive the area's been looted and ransacked beyond reasonable use, I say go for it.

[Darkness]

"How about just drive them into something like the grand canyon and torch them? Volcanoes would work too." :)

[Faran Brigo]

Tongue in cheek, funny, but it does bring up an important factor, and that is zeds are stupid, so it's important to use the terrain to gain an advantage.

I wonder if stenches would burn without the need to add more fuel though.

[Darkness]

"If you use the volcanoes you won't need to add fuel."

[detpat]

I don't think volcano fuel is gonna be common in the ZPAW.

[Faran Brigo]

Ok, cool, now all I need to do is find a volcano. I don't suppose you know where I can buy a portable one, do you? :P

[Darkness]

"I'm not talking about Volcanoe 'fuel', (is there really such a thing? ;-)) I'm talking about driving the zombies in to live Volcanoes to get rid of them." ;-)

[Faran Brigo]

Kind of impractical if you don't live near an active volcano 'innit?

That aside, I don't want to go to an active volcano, I think the zeds are probably a lesser threat.

[Darkness]

"It's just one of many ideas." :)

"It doesn't really have to be 'Active', come to think of it. Sleeping or Dormant would do, as long as it isn't Cored or Dead. It's the lave pool you want to make use of." :)

[detpat]

i was just funnin about the fuel LOL, zeds are volcano fuel!

[Faran Brigo]

There are a few salvageable things from WWZ, I liked the bit about "enticing mechanisms", tactics to draw out and lure zombies.

But I just don't see how static defense is a good idea against zeds. The one thing they got going for them is their capacity to advance relentlessly and not be scared off, I say it's better that we exploit our mobility: You could outmaneuver hordes of zeds with a brisk walk. Mind you, it's not something I'd want to do, but if the idea is just to keep falling back to stay out of their reach while you whittle their numbers down to nothing, well, it's something worth considering.

The most important thing needed (besides a large stockpile of ammo) I think, is the help of others: It's simply not feasible to kill hordes of zombies alone. Step one before going into the offensive I think, would be finding steady sources of supplies and getting enough survivors together to form a decent antighoul militia, or at least a few fireteams.

[Evil Pug]

I think that a war with the zeds would be a bad idea. If they are like NOTLD zombies, their numbers will only grow. Sure you could wipe out thousands maybe even millions, so what? You will lose some or most of the few living people in this war with the zeds. You need to fortify your borders and grow your numbers (make babies :)). Maybe after a few decades your chances of defeating the undead will be better.

[Faran Brigo]

The 3 main ideas you bring up are, the way I see it:

1.- "Their numbers will only grow", which is good as a movie catchphrase but it's flat out false. Zombies don't reproduce, they need to kill more people to grow in numbers, so as long as we kill more of them than they kill of us, their numbers will only lower. The fact that they probably outnumber the living exponentially just means we will have to kill many, MANY zombies for every loss. Assuming that there's only 50,000 survivors, for the U.S. alone, a casualty ratio of 1/9000 is enough to grant victory (at a great cost though). Considering we have tremendous advantages over zombies, I'd say those kind of rates or higher are not unrealistic within a decade or a bit more time, and likely there will be more than 50,000. Hell if you mounted 8 hour shifts on a high wall with a bunch of bricks of .22LR ammo and basically went to target practice with the crowd, you could rack up a huge body count in a few months without losing anyone, if you had a few hundred people doing so, again, the numbers rise dramatically. Cold, hard math.

2.- "You will lose some or most of the living people". So you don't know how many people will fight, with what gear, tactics, strategy and situation but already know that most of them will die? I can't be kind about this, I'm sorry, it's just laughable. That's a possibility, yes, but you don't know, nobody knows.

3.- "Grow in strenght and strenghten defenses" So how will you grow in numbers and strenght if you don't try to reclaim fertile ground, weapons stores, housing or anything else? If you want something, the only options left in a post apocalyptic world is learn to make it, learn to do without, or reclaim it from zackland, and guess what? you can't make everything and there are some things you can't do without.

If you want to survive, you need to go on the offensive eventually. Whether that means limited engangements for an objective or constant war of annihilation is a different matter. I do know this though: After a few decades, most pre apocalypse survivors will have died, and most of the infrastructure (along with the ammunition and other supplies you could reclaim from the infested zones) will be decayed and damaged beyond repair. This would make the job HARDER, not easier.

The ultimate kicker though, is that the greatest advantage zombies enjoy is numerical superiority, and the only way to take it away from them is to thin their ranks. Enough zombies will either overrun most kinds of defenses, or if they can't, they will certainly have a terrible impact on the mental health of whoever's under siege, and if you think that's not serious, consider that suicides were a common cause of death during ancient sieges (remember Masada?), and according to some psychological experiments, crowding and siege mentality breeds infighting.

You say it's best for our survival not to attack them, I say the only way we can have long term survival, for us, and for the people that will come after us, is to advance and reclaim what was once ours.

[detpat]

i still vote for the big plow equipped vehicle. It also gives you something to do on those long afternoons.

[Subgenius]

A lot of stuff said here is just too much fiction. But, then again, everything related to zombies must be fictional. Seriously, outside of fiction, if zombies could exist, then we are all screwed no matter what. It's an end-game. It's Judgement Day, Armageddon and an Apocalypse all rolled up into one.

Driving the zombies into the Grand Canyon? Why, they could just walk right out the other side. It's not simply a big, giant hole in the ground. There are likely hundreds or thousands or hundreds of thousands of ways that the zombies could get out. And, why bother? You would never get six billion zombies in there. You would not even be able to get a few thousand in there. It just makes no sense to me. The same applied to the volcano idea. You just could never get that many zombies to do what you wanted. Most humans, living and undead, live far away from volcanoes. This idea would not work in real life.

If the zombies don't kill you, then the man-made nuclear disasters will kill you. WWZ and DBDA both ignore that simple fact of life that we all live with every day in the US; 130 nuclear power plants with spent fuel rod buildings that MUST be kept up and running to super-cool those spent fuel rods. Otherwise, it will be the largest and worst nuclear disaster of all time. Those sites will be deadly for 240,000 years. Surrounding areas and regions would be deadly for centuries to come.

Let's put that aside for a minute.

A zombie is an undead thing, a creature that died and reanimated or resurrected as a dead thing that walks and consumes (human) flesh. We need to know what caused this. If it's an act of God, then forget about it. You are at war with God and you cannot win. If it's an infectious disease, then there is a glimmer of a hope. Science might cure it. By that, I mean make it so that no more dead people walk around, not that the undead could be made alive and whole and normal again.

That brings us to another issue: How does it spread? GAR zombies may or may not create other zombies through a bite or scratch. Any recently dead body could reanimate without a bite or scratch. This has a direct affect on how many zombies you will face out there in the dead world. If any recently killed human reanimates no matter what, then you could be looking at zombie numbers in the billions.

Let's address the idea of the spread of zombies. How many zombies will be generated in those first days and weeks of the outbreak? If the zombies kill and consume 50% of the humans on the planet, then we will have three billion zombies. This is the case in Romero films. Slow moving zombies allow for humans to escape with bites and scratches that become super-infected and kill the human. That act of God then raises them again. Or, the disease reanimated them. Or, the ambient radiation from that Venus Probe causes them to reanimate.

No matter what, you cannot stop it. The ONLY way to stop it would be to kill the first zombies that popped up. But, look at your local newspaper obituaries. I know that it's morbid. I do it to get an idea of how many people die in my area every day. That number is roughly 30 people every day in my city and surrounding suburbs and counties. It could be much higher in a city like NYC or LA. Now, project the numbers nationwide, or North American, or worldwide. If you knew ahead of time about the possible zombie outbreaks, then the heads of all of those people would have to be destroyed at the time of death. Zombie squads would be set up in police stations to respond to outbreaks caused by undiscovered and unidentified dead bodies. How many of those pop up around the nation every day?

"Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!" And, nobody will believe ahead of time that zombies will walk the earth. So, the spread of the zombie outbreak could be swift and deadly and the numbers could be as high as three billion.

You are screwed.

[Evil Pug]

The 3 main ideas you bring up are, the way I see it:

1.- "Their numbers will only grow", which is good as a movie catchphrase but it's flat out false. Zombies don't reproduce, they need to kill more people to grow in numbers, so as long as we kill more of them than they kill of us, their numbers will only lower. The fact that they probably outnumber the living exponentially just means we will have to kill many, MANY zombies for every loss. Assuming that there's only 50,000 survivors, for the U.S. alone, a casualty ratio of 1/9000 is enough to grant victory (at a great cost though). Considering we have tremendous advantages over zombies, I'd say those kind of rates or higher are not unrealistic within a decade or a bit more time, and likely there will be more than 50,000. Hell if you mounted 8 hour shifts on a high wall with a bunch of bricks of .22LR ammo and basically went to target practice with the crowd, you could rack up a huge body count in a few months without losing anyone, if you had a few hundred people doing so, again, the numbers rise dramatically. Cold, hard math.

2.- "You will lose some or most of the living people". So you don't know how many people will fight, with what gear, tactics, strategy and situation but already know that most of them will die? I can't be kind about this, I'm sorry, it's just laughable. That's a possibility, yes, but you don't know, nobody knows.

3.- "Grow in strenght and strenghten defenses" So how will you grow in numbers and strenght if you don't try to reclaim fertile ground, weapons stores, housing or anything else? If you want something, the only options left in a post apocalyptic world is learn to make it, learn to do without, or reclaim it from zackland, and guess what? you can't make everything and there are some things you can't do without.

If you want to survive, you need to go on the offensive eventually. Whether that means limited engangements for an objective or constant war of annihilation is a different matter. I do know this though: After a few decades, most pre apocalypse survivors will have died, and most of the infrastructure (along with the ammunition and other supplies you could reclaim from the infested zones) will be decayed and damaged beyond repair. This would make the job HARDER, not easier.

The ultimate kicker though, is that the greatest advantage zombies enjoy is numerical superiority, and the only way to take it away from them is to thin their ranks. Enough zombies will either overrun most kinds of defenses, or if they can't, they will certainly have a terrible impact on the mental health of whoever's under siege, and if you think that's not serious, consider that suicides were a common cause of death during ancient sieges (remember Masada?), and according to some psychological experiments, crowding and siege mentality breeds infighting.

You say it's best for our survival not to attack them, I say the only way we can have long term survival, for us, and for the people that will come after us, is to advance and reclaim what was once ours.

In every war there are going to be casualties. To think that you won't is foolish. All the zeds have to do is bite, with their overwhelming numbers this is going to happen to many that go into combat with the zeds. Zeds can take high loses but for the few remaining living it would be too costly. There would also be loses to friendly fire and accidents during a war with the zeds. The living that die (except for headshot) will join the zeds. Even in a safe area you have to look out for zombies. If one of the living dies from natural causes, they are going to come back as a zed. So you see that a war with them will never end. It's better to find terrain that will help in defense and has land good for farming. You quote a number of 50,000 survivers. How are going to join up all these seperated groups into a fighting force? Most likely the survivers of Z-DAY will be in small groups seperated from each other over vast areas. Just trying to get to these groups will cost you in lives lost. Even if you do, not all of them are going to be combat ready. How many of them are in good enough shape to fight? Do they have military training? It's going to take years just to raise, arm and train a army to fight the zeds. The United States has a population of about 300,000,000. That's 6000 to 1 odds for the zeds! Now that is cold hard math. Survival of the species (humans) has to be the top priority! The most you can hope to do is stop the zeds, but your never going to wipe them out completely. I know that you want to fight them but until you have the numbers that can give you the best chance of winning it's best that you wait before going on a major offensive against the zeds.

[detpat]

sure it'll end, it'll just take some adaptation and adjustment to overcome a new condition. Humans are good at this sort of thing.

[Subgenius]

sure it'll end, it'll just take some adaptation and adjustment to overcome a new condition. Humans are good at this sort of thing.

I agree that the human will to survive and prosper is a powerful thing. But, it has a limit. If less than 50,000 people survive, then the human species is an endangered species. And, Mankind has been there before in our past history, or rather in our pre-history. Zombies would simply push humanity far past that breaking point. In the really real world, I do not believe that Mankind could withstand a zombie outbreak in the Romero model.

[detpat]

having been involved with both mil and civ public safety i feel that humanity would survive such an event. Panic will cause more casualties than the zeds themselves. Cities will suffer more than rural areas or smaller towns, and there will certainly be more casualties among some demographics than others, but overall the response of public safety will be very proactive.

I think It's a mistake to believe that the simple act of misconstruing the cause of the outbreak will allow the outbreak to escalate beyond control instantly. Many measures will not differ significantly from one vector to another. Control of violent infectees will still consist of confinement and control regardless of the causal factor.

[Subgenius]

having been involved with both mil and civ public safety i feel that humanity would survive such an event. Panic will cause more casualties than the zeds themselves. Cities will suffer more than rural areas or smaller towns, and there will certainly be more casualties among some demographics than others, but overall the response of public safety will be very proactive.

I think It's a mistake to believe that the simple act of misconstruing the cause of the outbreak will allow the outbreak to escalate beyond control instantly. Many measures will not differ significantly from one vector to another. Control of violent infectees will still consist of confinement and control regardless of the causal factor.

If we had been discussing a chemical spill or a hurricane disaster or an earthquake, tsunami, landslide, volcano eruption, etc, etc, etc, then I think that you would be correct. But, the difference is that those are all real; very, very real out there in the really real world. Zombies are not real. Or, so the assumption has gone for almost all of history. Stories and legends and myths popped up, sure. But, seriously, they never materialized.

Let us assume that they had been real stories. Unless we saw an outbreak in our modern era, I still doubt that anybody would believe it. The news stations would not run "The Dead Walk" as a headline or a screen blurb. They would call it something else. I doubt that they would even run actual footage of zombies walking around because they would just have to assume they were faked. By the time they had been validated as truth, it would be way too late.

Disbelief would kill more people than anything else. I'm a huge zombie fan, but I would NEVER believe that it could really, really happen.

[detpat]

the thing is, the way that a cop or soldier deals with the real world dangers is gonna serve him nearly as well with a zed encounter.

[Faran Brigo]

Subgenius: Honestly I'm not trying to be insulting, and I mean this in the most respectful way.

Okay, putting aside the problem with your arguments, which is they're largely based on making simple judgements about complex situations without knowing the relevant facts (prejudment, more commonly known as prejudice), you're using fiction... to disprove fiction... I guess the main point I'd have to make here, and I'm trying to be kind about this, is that you just don't get it.

"But if it really DID happen, we're all screwed"... Is there even a point to arguing about what would REALLY happen if corpses started walking and feasting on the living because "god" was pissed at us? :lol:

If you honestly think can't survive and defend against the undead, then maybe you shouldn't post in "Undead survival and defense"? and if you think discussing this isn't simply an entertaining hobby for zombie fiction aficionados but an honest excercise on planning for an undead apocalypse, then... :loon:

And if you don't, then must you be such a killjoy? I apologize in advance if it sounds offensive, it's meant to be a light hearted jab.

[Subgenius]

There is NOTHING wrong with being realistic. Movies make the survival look, well, easy. I don't think that it would be. And, that's my point. People just will not believe that zombies have returned from the dead to plague the living. This thread is about taking the fight to the zombies and winning. Right? Did I miss something? That's what I have talking about. I responded to a comment from somebody. So, don't get bent out of shape.

Now, on to better stuff. I am not using fiction to disprove fiction. I am using it to show how people will NOT believe that the dead can return to life as the undead seeking human flesh. Because of that people would get killed. They would not believe it. This is a big part of many zombie films, except films that focus on the post-outbreak situations.

No "prejudice" there or any sort of "simple judgements about complex situations." If you think that, then so be it. I am just expressing my opinion. That opinion is that there is no winning a war with the zombies after the outbreak has become too large. And, stopping it in the early stages is problematic due to rampant disbelief in the undead in any form.

[fester_hicks]

Nature will eventually "take the fight to the Zeds". Im more worried about immed. survival and that of my family.

Gonna find a place to whole up and see what happens!

[Shadowalker191]

As much fun as a snow plow would be, I personially would love to get my hands on one of them Aardvark mine clearing tanks that have been on futureweapons and such.

200 ton tank with a 20 foot wide spindle of 30 pound hammers on chains, flail
's spinning at high rates of speed normally used to destroy land mines, just picture what that would do to the zeds.

Oh ya, it's armored too.

[mattifikation]

Step One: Global cooling. Start another ice age, right here on earth.

Frostbite is what occurs when the water in and between your cells freeze. A brain is destroyed by frostbite. A zombie is killed by the destruction of its brain.

Humans can adapt to cooling temperatures. We know how to build fires. We know how to build shelter. We know how make thicker clothing. We know when to do all these things to survive. We are warm blooded and alive, which means that we can biologically adapt to changing temperatures.

The zombies can't do any of this. They don't know when they're cold. They can't moderate their blood flow to account for dropping temperatures. They can't make shelter, and even if they could, they don't know when they need to. They're stuck with whatever clothing they had on when they died.

The only way we could alter the climate to such a degree is with nuclear weapons. Now hear me out! Obviously we can't just set off a few thousand nuclear weapons, we'd all die from radiation poisoning. What we could do, however, is use nuclear weapons to set off much larger, natural explosions.

I'm talking volcanoes. Nuclear weapons could be used to release the built up energy in all the world's supervolcanoes, causing a massive drop in global temperatures. We know that certain volcanoes have altered the climate when they went off individually. By combining their power, we could cover the earth in freezing temperatures.

Now granted, if this plan were utilized then those living in parts of the world that are already cold would probably be history. So would anyone unfortunate enough to live near the chosen volcanoes. You would have to coordinate an effort among survivors to get them out of the danger areas and to places that would stay just warm enough for them to survive if they stayed in sheltered areas.

Food would also be an issue that you would have to address. One solution would be for people to operate hydroponic labs, powered by steam engines that would be used to run generators. One way or another, food would have to be grown indoors.

Of course some animals can live quite well in cold climates. These animals would become another food source, and probably a major one. If you could find a way to get polar animals to migrate closer to the equator, which is where you would also want the survivors to be living during this operation, then that would be great.

At any rate, you would need to initiate enough global cooling to drop temperatures to below freezing across the entire planet for at least a year straight. If any place remained warmer than freezing, or if any place didn't remain cold for long enough, then that place would be a haven for any zombie that might randomly be wandering around there. So basically, you'd have to make sure you overdid it by quite a bit.

Step Two: Massive global warming. Return the earth to a livable climate.

Again, what's the one technique we have to make sure this happens? You guessed it: Nuclear weapons!

This time, instead of filling the atmosphere with sun-blocking clouds of volcanic ash, you want to increase the temperature of the planet. But how can that be accomplished?

For starters, remove the ice cubes. Nuclear weapons could be used to blow the polar regions to bits, and superheat what used to be the coldest water on earth. The world's currents would carry that hot water into the oceans, raising water temperatures ever-so-slightly. Now remember, we just froze the world, so what's left in the water will be animals well adapted to the cold. This sudden heating would be devastating to marine life, killing most of what's in it. How is that helpful? Well...

80% of all oxygen production in the world is done by algae. That means that 80% of the carbon dioxide is consumed by it as well. When the aquatic ecosystem crash causes a drop in the world's algae population, the resulting in a build-up of greenhouse gas in the atmosphere and... global warming!

Now granted, this plan has the possibility of ending all life on earth if you calculate poorly. But the other option is to let the world be overrun by zombies, so its not like destroying the world would still be a huge loss at this point. Think of it like this... you've just gone broke, lost everything and all your money. You've got one quarter, and you happen to live near Vegas. Why not gamble that last quarter on a slot machine? If you lose, heck, you were poor anyway. If you win, you aren't broke anymore.

I would also like to point out that global climate change is utilized as the ultimate enemy of zombies in this plan. Global warming is also the ultimate enemy of Al Gore. Therefore, Al Gore must be a zombie....

[Faran Brigo]

Those kind of calculations, global cooperation and coordination, and resources would be hard to muster for the U.S., the Europeans or the Chinese right now, pre zombie epidemic. If it gets to the point where causing worldwide ecological destruction is not really worse by much than not doing it, we've long since lost the capability of pulling that off.

In other words, I guess your analogy would be more correct if you had a few nickels but the slot machine would only take quarters.

[mattifikation]

It all depends. Let's say there's 6.4 billion people in the world. 3 billion become zombies. 1 billion are eaten by zombies. 2 billion die from the rioting, fighting, and the collapse of society. That would leave 400,000 people roaming the earth. Certainly not very many.

But let's say that 1 percent of those people find a way to get into contact with each other by ham radio, walkie-talkies, and so-on. That's 4,000 people. Now let's say I'm in that group, and I propose this idea to that network of people. Obviously we need more people, so each of us over the next few months manages to recruit 5 more people to our cause, for a total of 20,000 people. For argument's sake, assume half of us are also killed during that time frame and we're left with just 10,000 people.

That's enough to form a small army right there. Since there would probably be no group out there to oppose it, other than the mindless zombies themselves, they might be able to pull it off. Even if 90 percent of them are killed carrying out the plan, that still leaves a thousand people to see it through to completion.

[fester_hicks]

good grief... its getting thick (with bodies..lol) around here...

SNOW PLOW.. SNOW PLOW.. with a .50 cal mounted on top

[kai055]

things like tractors and jcb may work, slow but heavy and some well armoured

[Lian]

A plan to kill 6,602,224,174 zombies is still being formulated. I'm up to an estimated 6 million, in my general area assuming nothing goes wrong and I die. I'll bet back to you with the remaining 6,596,224,174. :evil:


All in all though I'm of the opinion to just kill them on a need by need basis. As long as I can keep my sign out that says zombie free since 2013 out for 100 miles around me then I'll be happy. And if any zombies wanna stumble within ten miles of my proudly zombie free area I'll be glad to kill them too. As for the rest of them let nature run it's course ashes to ashes dust to dust.

Now granted if I find some kind of gaseous or liquid type chemical substance that instantly kills a zombie on contact that I can release from an airborne location reliably killing whole areas infested with zombies....Load up the crop duster we're taking back the city. :drinking:

[Slayer]

Know what I think? I don't think a force even numbering in the tens of thousands would be capable of killing Billions of Zombies. They would screw up at some points, and their numbers would wane, in the end I think defeat would be inevitable. But there is a way to largely eliminate the zombie threat, at a great cost of possible supplies and survivors worldwide. Even a band of under a hundred people, well armed, with a convoy of pickup trucks, could make their way to ICBM silos, seize control of them and begin to target cities. ICBM silo's tend to be in rural areas, so there probably wouldn't be too many zombies out there. Explosives might be needed to breech the blast doors, and it would take awhile going from site to site, so lots of food supplies and fuel would be needed, and they would need to scavenge for supplies along the way. But a determined band of survivors could put quite a dent in the zombie population if such an action would succeed, since zombie outbreaks tend to start in cities, most of them would hopefully be still located in them. :skull:

[RogueAI]

Know what I think? I don't think a force even numbering in the tens of thousands would be capable of killing Billions of Zombies. They would screw up at some points, and their numbers would wane, in the end I think defeat would be inevitable. But there is a way to largely eliminate the zombie threat, at a great cost of possible supplies and survivors worldwide. Even a band of under a hundred people, well armed, with a convoy of pickup trucks, could make their way to ICBM silos, seize control of them and begin to target cities. ICBM silo's tend to be in rural areas, so there probably wouldn't be too many zombies out there. Explosives might be needed to breech the blast doors, and it would take awhile going from site to site, so lots of food supplies and fuel would be needed, and they would need to scavenge for supplies along the way. But a determined band of survivors could put quite a dent in the zombie population if such an action would succeed, since zombie outbreaks tend to start in cities, most of them would hopefully be still located in them. :skull:

You can't launch a missile from a missile silo. Weird, huh? You need two people in the silo, and two people at another military installation to turn keys allowing launch. The missile is then given its target from a third site. With lots of rewiring though, it could work. I would be worried about nuclear fall out.

I like mattifikation's way of thinking. Cold and calculating.

For me, the answer to Zeds is biological. Design an airborne virus that kills the Zombie-causing Bactria or Parasite.

[jim96sc2]

Why nuke zombies and add nuclear fallout to your list of things that are working against your survival?:loon:

[Lian]

Wow...yea let's nuke the zombies...that couldn't possibly be a bad idea. :loon:

Just a thought though I think many urban centers and city's might just burn to the ground by themselves. You got to figure people struggling to survive running for their lives and what not they are gonna be knocking over the candles, dropping cigarettes in flammable materials, leaving the stove on, crashing into gas stations. And with no Fire Department to combat these fires popping up they have the potential to get worse and spread. Fires could sweep through suburbs leaving nothing but ash in some area's and not touching others at all pending conditions. But given congestion downtown in major cites I'd almost bet those fires could jump lighting the whole city up like a hay field.

[Tripoli]

You do not have enough ammunition to take the fight to the zombies. Plus there will be looters and other bad people out there to take your goodies from you. If you do take the fight to the ghouls then a silenced 22 is the way to go…. I bought 10,000 rounds of high quality for $400 and plan to buy another 10,000. . . Soon

[Slayer]

Fallout could take weeks to months to dissipate, I forgot to add that I would have enough supplies of food and water and appropriate shelters ready to go down in until the fallout goes away. With the possibility of ending the threat of 1 Billion zombies or more, it could be a possible help to the zombie problem, but not without it's costs.

[RogueAI]

Fallout could take weeks to months to dissipate, I forgot to add that I would have enough supplies of food and water and appropriate shelters ready to go down in until the fallout goes away. With the possibility of ending the threat of 1 Billion zombies or more, it could be a possible solution, but not without it's costs.

Months? No, years. It gets in the soil you grow food on, it gets in the ocean, it is carried by the jet stream to other continents, ect ect. There are many island chains all over the world that you cannot fish in because of nuclear testing over fifty years ago. Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and Chernobyl are all safe now; however, depending on the delivery system, nuclear weapons are ten (Ground delivery) to one hundred (air delivery) to three hundred (ICBM delivery) times more powerful now. Plus, ICBM's can carry as many as six war heads so you can hit six nearby targets simultaneously.

I still like the idea of using 'em to cause global climate change, though. I think we'd cause the earth the permanently snow ball or become similar to venus, though. And I think it could be pulled off.

[DBCooper]

Bad idea, they will be too many.... We will be too few. . . this is the truth...

[Slayer]

Months? No, years. It gets in the soil you grow food on, it gets in the ocean, it is carried by the jet stream to other continents, ect ect. There are many island chains all over the world that you cannot fish in because of nuclear testing over fifty years ago. Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and Chernobyl are all safe now; however, depending on the delivery system, nuclear weapons are ten (Ground delivery) to one hundred (air delivery) to three hundred (ICBM delivery) times more powerful now. Plus, ICBM's can carry as many as six war heads so you can hit six nearby targets simultaneously.

I still like the idea of using 'em to cause global climate change, though. I think we'd cause the earth the permanently snow ball or become similar to venus, though. And I think it could be pulled off.

I wouldn't be launching them to areas near where my people were located, fallout tends to settle onto the ground after a certain period of time and it's lethal radioactive effects tends to lessen over a time. Contaminated soil would have to be disposed of, or taken to an isolated area, and dumped. Probably take an inch off the top to be safe, but i'm no expert on these things.

I wouldn't want to facilitate a climate change...

However, one way to go after the zombies is this. Wait about a year, then begin preparations, form up groups of survivors, train them, stock sufficient supplies. Food, water, tools, car parts, gasoline, guns and ammo. Then after a couple years of time, begin to move out from your immediate area in groups, clearing each area of zombies, and moving on. Groups of vehicles, preferably pickup trucks would carry the supplies, and be the transports. It would be slow, and wouldn't clear the planet in a short period of time, but it would probably work. Leave a certain amount of people behind to keep the area under the control of the living, and to make use of the land to replenish food supplies through farming. It would take time, and it may only result in regaining territory.

[RogueAI]

In a combination of a couple of ideas. Why not just start burning cities at the beginning? This would clear out many of the zombies who probably won't even recognize that anything is going on.

[Faran Brigo]

I agree with the burning proposal. Major cities are just not worth the effort it would take to clear them out. House to house fighting with live targets is already pretty hectic and costly. If the targets won't go down unless headshot, it would get exponentially worse, and close combat denies us two of the greatest strenghts we have in combat relative to zombies: speed and range. It's probably just not worth the effort.

The nuclear option, I believe, is a lousy idea. Ocassional tactical nuclear strikes maybe, but using strategic weapons to raze every major world city? how many survivors would die in the fallout laden areas? and how much valuable resources would be lost to radiation for decades? what about highly radioactive zeds? I think it's an all around bad idea.

[Slash Maraud]

Taking back real estate lost to Zed would have to start small. Find a small town infested and work on tactics. You can't just expect to walk/drive/run into a town and start blasting. Careful recon of the area might disclose a natural or man-made choke point that you could lure Zed into and then finish him off at your leisure. Also with a careful and thorough recon you might discover survivors who know how many Zeds are in the area so you have a rough idea of how many hostiles you'll be facing.

The scorched earth policy be it nuclear, napalm or just set the fires yourself would destroy and contaminate way too much in potential resources. Some major cities are also sites for refineries and large food distribution warehouses. Nuking a city destroys those resources same as napalm.

House to house is totally out as too time consuming and risky. One option would be to block the areas off with the most Zeds using semi trucks or buses then take care of the stragglers. If, the area with most Zeds just happens to be the area that you need to get to, then obviously tactics will have to be amended to deal with that problem.

The use of airport fire trucks with water cannons could be used to push Zed back into an area that will contain them, or refill the water cannon with diesel or kerosene, spray and light them. That option could have serious reprucussions as they might set fire to what you need.

Taking the fight to Zed will require time, patience and planning. It can't be something that you just whip up in a few minutes and let it fly. Murphy's Law has a wonderful way of rearing its ugly head at the most inopportune time and its highly likely that it will do so in this event.

[Lian]

Murphy was an optimist. :lol:

But yea seriously. Start small is a valid point. I'm not so sure that scorched earth isn't such a bad strategy in major cities though. Small towns are one thing several million former residents trapped in buildings and crap. I think potential risks far out weigh the benefits there. I'm still of the opinion though that major cities may burn of their own accord without any help on our part though.

And anyone who thinks nuking is a good idea is a moron. The whole dangerous part of a nuke isn't the relatively small amount of flame that lays waste to an area it's the nuclear fall out that engulfs the entire area killing the people with radiation sickness which may not even effect zombies at all. All you'll make them do is glow in the dark.

[Slash Maraud]

Considering that any offensive against Zed starts small and that you have adequate supplies to last for a prolonged incursion into zed occupied zones, the ideal team would be 50 people.

Based on the recon and intel info gathered about the objective, say in this case a Costco full of consumables and other needed supplies, most Costcos are not right downtown major cities and usually located near a Wal-Mart and/or Home Depot, that makes the operation a bit easier in terms of resupply.

Its a given that Wally World will have been looted for anything not nailed down so that building might give the team a place to hole up and re-assess the overal tactical picture. From the roof, snipers and spotters can get a general count of the Zeds in the area and provide cover for the assault team.

Lets say that your team has the basic skills, experience and equipment to make this op look good on paper at least.

Leaving ten shooters on the roof of Wally, the rest move in up-armored vehicles to Costco. Salvaged buses block the front door and provide additional cover while two semi trucks move to the back and, with the prior intel, know that the loading dock doors are still closed and the loading area is empty of vehicles. Once backed in, the rear of the trucks open and the main force opens the bay doors and begins sweep and clear ops inside.

Time on Target or TOT =10min from actual start to clear.

Now you control the Wal-Mart and have secured the Costco. The next step is to load half the assault force back into one semi and move to the Home Depot for a repeat after retrieving half the shooters from the roof and placing them on the Costco roof. The remaining assault force now pulls double duty as rear security and forage.

As with any campaign to remove hostile influence from an area, you have to deny the area to the hostile force. Once you have taken the objective, you can't just leave it and let Zed retake it. Fortify the buildings and use them as a jumping off point to continue the offensive. Consolidate everything into the most defensible building if at all possible. Manpower, firepower and experience will be the key to taking the fight to Zeds backyard and maybe stand a chance at eliminating the infection.

One idea would be to locate a large tow truck, like the kind that tow semis, or a small construction crane and use it to move the abandoned cars from roads or parking lots and stack them to form a wall around your secured buildings or at least tip them up on its side and build a wall like that. Tipping the car up on its side can be done by hand but its time consuming and tiring.

[Headless Lynx]

Some of you probably know this already but I would go on the offensive straight away. I don't care if it's been 2 days or 2 years, i'll go on the offensive as soon as I see a walking hurk of meat. I would go in by night and kill as many of those braindead bums and then return to my hideout for some R'n'R and to protect my girlfriend.
Some of you may be thinking "Why the hell at night?!" some of you may know about Diary of The Dead, well there's a guy on there who fights zeds at night, why? Because zeds are stupid and they can't see you if it's pitch black, and I could see them because i'd have NVG's

[Slayer]

About the scorched earth policy...

It all depends on blast radius, fallout will be dispersed all over the general area, and yes carried to other more distant places by whichever way the wind blows. But anything in the blast radius dies, even zombies would be reduced to ash by the extreme heat.

But as I and many others have said, using these against zombies does come at a cost.

[Death Insurance]

Well hell, I'd just nuke the damn world if I could. I've never been one for "save the Earth" in the first place, so its not like it'd matter to me at that point. Otherwise, since nukes aren't sold at Wal-Mart, I'd probably just burn a couple cities.

[VXTip556]

i like how its shown in night of the living dead and dawn of the dead, when soldiers and hicks with guns just roam the country side taking out zombies. I think that would be extremely effective if enough survivors and ammo could be gathered

[Mrgibins]

Neclear warfare is always a bad idea, I like the start small proposal, I would start in the south, plenty of land, food, water, but less popluated then the rest of America

[jim96sc2]

Neclear warfare is always a bad idea, I like the start small proposal, I would start in the south, plenty of land, food, water, but less popluated then the rest of America

Agree. Your not going to kill enough, your going to irradiate a large area, and now you have flesh eating walking corpses who also are radioactive. Great you kill them, how are you going to dispose of the irradiated bodies without poisoning yourself.

[Faran Brigo]

Considering that any offensive against Zed starts small and that you have adequate supplies to last for a prolonged incursion into zed occupied zones, the ideal team would be 50 people.

What about guerrilla tactics first? we're faster than any zombie, and more mobile. We get tired and they don't, true, but we can fix that with vehicles. Go in, take down as many as you can from a safe range, then bug out when it looks like they may overwhelm your position. You could set up combustibles along your escape route and set them on fire as the zombies follow you to take down even more. Repeat until they're weak enough for an assault like you mention.

If they're so numerous this is an impractical, I think it's still a good idea to rehearse some tactics, do recon in force, and provide the forces to be used with practical experience.

[Umbrela]

There probably won't be much to take back. With the Zack taking the world, the governments will probably panic and carpet bomb most of the cities.

[Faran Brigo]

Because obviously any government in place does not think about political self preservation and does not care whether its constituents will lop their heads off if the crisis is indeed overcome...

Yeah... I doubt that. The U.S. armed forces don't have enough conventional explosives to carpet bomb most (more than half of) all urban areas in the U.S., the initial campaign on Iraq alone depleted stocks of munitions and Iraq is orders of magnitude less urbanized and it wasn't carpet bombed.

Plus, if there is enough coherency and resources to carpet bomb cities to the ground, zack isn't taking over the world, zack's being turned into pudding with high explosives.

[Dave Of The Dead]

I wouldn't be half surprised if the U.S. nuked their own territory to keep zeds from spreading. We gotta use the 25,000 nuclear devices for something right?


I seriously think that I would just get a bunch of bikers with axes, and metal pipes and ride through the city on a chopper lopping off any head that gets in reach. If I were alone for that long trying to stay alive, I would probably go nuts and actually do it. Then realize that Its just me skitzo-ing the whole thing while i sit in the corner.

[CaptainWow424]

I sort of like the City-Burn idea. But you would have to loot key places first. I would get a map of teh city first, loot all the gun stores and food markets, and then find the gas stations, and assign like 2 to 3 man teams to go prep each one to be set on fire with like a delayed fuse or something (easily made with cigarettes :) ) and then get the hell out of there. Then the infected we flush out of the city we then shoot, or kill in some way, and burn the bodies in bon fires to get rid of any sighns of infection. But I could only do that if i had enough people.

[wolffy4]

id do what they did in resident evil get out of htere as fast as you can then bomb the place

[JakAttak]

All I'd try to do is survive and let pro's handle it all. But if their was a national call to arms I would gather up the largest group I could find all the supplies I could find go to a narrow choke point and draw all Z's in the area and snipe them before they got close.

[DemonChild]

...I'd draw them into a movie theatre and make them watch the Sex and the City Movie. :lol:

[killnburn]

that is just inhuman man.... there is a limit to everything.... nuke them fine, burn them fine, hell tear them to small pieces its fine but sex and the city.... its just toooo much..... even sending chuck norris would be more human...

[JakAttak]

too true, too many people have been claimed by sex and the city. STOP THE MADNESS!!!!

[vlad tech]

this is what i would do in a zombie attack plz give me advise i dont want to die.

1st. Since i have the back corner of the back corner of the apts i surprisingly have a advantage. Theres a culdasac behind me so filled with houses and apts by it the zombie will go there 1st ill. Grab my swords, knifes armored boots, my goggles and a mask.

2nd. Run down to walmart after finding survivour (hopefully with guns). Get the van at the apts in the matinince area then close the STEEL garrage doors. Use the tons of barbaques, tech goods, bikes and generaly big items to barricade.

3rd part. since theres a mc donalds inside theres naturaly 1 of those big freezer thingys. Store half the food in there. Make the loud speaker system wireless. Set up a gamming area along with group of cells incase of infect survivours so they can live out there short lives there.

4th. Prepare weapons spears from the the paint ball guns and co2 tanks by striping them and making a trigger then attaching a rod where normaly the barrel would be. Next make the spears (or use the metal spikes like you use on fences).

5th. armor the fan and possible a truck with a roof accses and do the propan tank thing from dawn of the dead. Put a cage with minor holes so we can shoot and drive but ill be in the van ;). Add slits in the van for a chain saw put them on a track (which would have never caused them to crash in D.o.a.d.)

6th. drive around throwing boom boxes every where with people taliking and screaming recorded so they might go there. Drive till we find another large base where theres not a lot of zombies camp with them get gas and drive off again.

[Behemoth]

Re-think your plan to avoid walmart ( or any large store ) there will be gangs of armed looters there along with zombies chomping bits off idiots carrying plasma tvs, pcs etc.
Ditch the paint ball guns, just use your sword, you should think in terms of avoidance, ie just dodge the zombies don't bother trying to fight 'em.
Don't go looking for survivors, ever heard the phrase "too many cooks spoil the broth", a group of six is plenty big enough.

[vlad tech]

its a big store with lots of food not lots of entrances or glass. therefore i can have a group of 12 or less. this will help the barricading process. also im not using a paint ball gun persay im changing it so it can fire hand made spears. sword wont do very mush againt crowds

also for ny1 who reads this here a little tip knocking a zombie down does do good the zombies will trip whiles hes getting up causing a zombie pile up ;)

[Behemoth]

You see, there was once upon a time a large thread about walmart on this forum, it is just a fact that in a zombie outbreak the world & his mother will head for wallmart, so not only will you fighting zombies you will be in conflict with about 200 other people, that sort of a number would be ( imo ) unsafe, you will have people self appointing themselves leaders & then all hell breaks loose, that's without even fighting the zombies.

[mattifikation]

Ahhh, another fresh corpse with a Wal-Mart plan. Let's disect.

Step 1:
You've assumed that the zombies are smart. Zombies are not smart, they will not know that there is more food for them in the apartments behind you. If they're coming from your direction, sorry, but they're gonna get to you first - not last. Also, I see you're bringing along a bunch of swords and knives. I sure hope these are real swords. Assuming they are, you're better off bringing one sword and one, maybe two knives - depending on the size of the knives. Swords are neither light, nor space-conservative, so extras will just weigh you down.

Step 2:
You've gone to wal-mart. You will die there in a zombie outbreak. Of course, if you are somehow privy to the knowledge of the outbreak before anyone else, it makes a great pit-stop. But if you want to live, you'll get your stuff and go. Listen to me carefully: YOU WILL NOT BE THE ONLY ONE THERE, NEITHER YOU, NOR YOUR GROUP OF 12. THERE WILL BE OTHER PEOPLE WITH BIGGER GROUPS AND BETTER WEAPONS READY TO KILL YOU TO HAVE THE PLACE FOR THEMSELVES, AND THE INFECTED WILL BE CRAWLING ALL OVER IT IN NO TIME!!!!!

Step 3:
Not that you'll have made it to your third step following this plan, but if you did, you've made some really poor choices here. First of all, the power to that freezer will probably be out within 24 hours. THE BACKUP GENERATOR WILL GIVE YOU A HALF HOUR, TOPS. I work at Wal-Mart, I've been there for power outages, and the half-hour we're supposed to get is generous at best and a JOKE in reality. Your next big mistake: Wireless loud speaker system. First of all, it's a waste of time. Second, it offers no benefit. Third, the loud speaker will be the least of your worries. And your major flaw in step three, which is a bigger newbie screw up than going to Wal-Mart (if that's possible,) is setting up an area for "the infected" to do anything other than be shot in the head.

Step 4:
Those home-made spear guns wouldn't be worth jack against a zombie. I doubt they'd work at all, and if they did, they'd almost certainly be ineffective at piercing a skull. Doesn't your wal-mart have guns?

Step 5:
So you've spent all this effort trying to fortify Wal-Mart, just to bail on the place immediately afterwards? Wow, you are SO dead. I would NOT want to be traveling in your group. Now, a few things. 1: Propane tanks don't do that when they explode, and besides, fire and shrapnel are lousy zombie killers. 2: A large crowd can, and will, stop any van, turn it over, and easily get inside. 3: You are not going to have the time or the supplies to build a chainsaw on a track, and even if you do, if you look at the structure of any vehicle you will see that there's not a single one on the market that will let you put the track the whole way around it, 360 degrees. 4. This plan didn't even work in a hollywood movie... there's no Way it would work in real life.

Step 6:
So you're going to waste gas to lay out a diversion that will either not work, or just create a breadcrumb trail leading straight to you. And this plan involves hundreds of boom boxes, utilizing space that could have been food or weapons instead, and moves on to you stopping at some random base - which you expect not to be full of people who will either kill you or eat you. And finally, you will ride off into the sunset with either a van or a truck (so, 10 mpg at best) to go off to... absolutely nowhere?

DUDE, YOU ARE GOING TO BE ONE OF THE FIRST ONES DEAD. YOU NEED TO ABSOLUTELY RETHINK VIRTUALLY EVERY SINGLE ASPECT OF YOUR PLAN, FROM START TO FINISH, OTHERWISE THE BEST HOPE YOU WILL HAVE ON Z-DAY IS TO BE ENTIRELY EATEN INSTEAD OF BEING ZOMBIFIED!!!

[Faran Brigo]

Well said Matt, but OWCH hahaha

[bandits1]

Hold up...I understand the danger of going to Wal-Mart because of hordes of panicky, greedy, desperate survivors - but why does everyone automatically assume that it'll be filled with zombies?

It seems to be a popular opinion here that zombies don't get "hungry" and they don't go seeking out food. They stay exactly where they are unless something grabs their attention through sight, sound, or smell. I live within a half-mile of a Wal-Mart and I can neither see it, smell it, or hear any noises coming from it from where I am. If there aren't any zombies within sight/sound/smell range of a particular Wal-Mart, there aren't going to be any zombies.

[mattifikation]

Think about it for a second. There's going to be hundreds of panicked, still living people rushing to the place for supplies.

At least one of them is going to be dumb and infected, and show up at Wal-Mart right about the time they turn and start infecting everyone else.

[bandits1]

True - with such a large amount of people free to come-and-go as they please, it is a distict possibility that an infected person could infiltrate the crowd and turn while inside of Wal-Mart, but barring any existing zombies within sensory-range of that Wal-Mart, the only thing you have to worry about are the people inside.

No infected people = no zombies.

My point was - if the popular opinion about how zombies operate is correct, the ones that are out of sensory-range aren't going to automatically flock there just because that's where all the people are(unless they're like the ones in DOTD '04).

[Dave Of The Dead]

Not a very good plan. Throw away your paintball guns and get real ones.

[Faran Brigo]

My point was - if the popular opinion about how zombies operate is correct, the ones that are out of sensory-range aren't going to automatically flock there just because that's where all the people are(unless they're like the ones in DOTD '04).

Or if they're like the ones in NOTLD. I'm guessing a bunch of panicked people looting is far noisier than your average day at a supermarket. Afterwards it's going to be even harder because everything else will be silent, there will be little background noise to drown out the walmart.

Also, what about zombies following the people that went there?

[Hitman]

the wall-mart here is right next to a very large neighborhood . zombies will get there in no time.

[Behemoth]

Hold up...I understand the danger of going to Wal-Mart because of hordes of panicky, greedy, desperate survivors - but why does everyone automatically assume that it'll be filled with zombies?

It seems to be a popular opinion here that zombies don't get "hungry" and they don't go seeking out food. They stay exactly where they are unless something grabs their attention through sight, sound, or smell. I live within a half-mile of a Wal-Mart and I can neither see it, smell it, or hear any noises coming from it from where I am. If there aren't any zombies within sight/sound/smell range of a particular Wal-Mart, there aren't going to be any zombies.
I agree, however zombies or no zombies, walmart in an outbreak would be a mess, aside from the zombies outside, you have idiots with guns inside, looters don't take kindly to being told what to do, if you have something someone wants & a confrontation starts & you get shot, you're dead, same as being bit by a zombie. Walmarts & other big stores are hit & run targets, get in quick/get out quick.

[mattifikation]

I know that at my Wal-Mart we employ approximately 400 people. Factor in days off, being open 24/7, and vacations and such, I think it's safe to say that there's AT LEAST 150 of us working during normal hours, probably more than that.

I'd estimate that for every person working, there's at least 10 people shopping. AT LEAST.

Which means, rough estimate, there are 1,500 people shopping in our Wal-Mart under normal conditions. And we're a small town, in a small county, in a very lightly populated area of the state.

Now, under panicking situations it's going to be even more packed. I'd say 10 times as many people, easy. 15,000 people trying to get into Wal-Mart.

These are all very conservative estimates. Anytime you've got 15,000 panicked people in one place during a zombie outbreak, there are two things that are even more tightly guaranteed than the flame on a Zippo lighter:

1. There's going to be violent, armed people.
2. There's going to be infected people.

[Behemoth]

The other thing with walmarts or any other big store, if they think there is gonna be a panic they will close up shop, so you may waste a couple of hours getting there & find it's closed up.

[Faran Brigo]

Considering that any offensive against Zed starts small and that you have adequate supplies to last for a prolonged incursion into zed occupied zones, the ideal team would be 50 people.

Based on the recon and intel info gathered about the objective, say in this case a Costco full of consumables and other needed supplies, most Costcos are not right downtown major cities and usually located near a Wal-Mart and/or Home Depot, that makes the operation a bit easier in terms of resupply.
.... Manpower, firepower and experience will be the key to taking the fight to Zeds backyard and maybe stand a chance at eliminating the infection.

Advance slowly and safely and with good intel and tactics. I love it. Plus the idea of making the offensive at least partly self-sustaining is brilliant.

[JakAttak]

nukes would be a bad idea. sure we've stopped the zombie plague hooray. only now the land is to irradiated to use for a few thousand years.

[Faran Brigo]

Thousand years? You're confusing nuclear strikes with nuclear meltdowns. Hiroshima was already rebuilt by the 1970's. As long as they don't use cobalt bombs it should be fine in a decade or two, by that time the most intensely radioactive elements would have decayed.

[Dave Of The Dead]

We've done nuclear testing on american soil before, but of course that was in the deserts so not much was effected.

[UNDEAD FRED]

I like the soylent green type of scoops, but have industrial strength wood chippers in the back.:lol:

[Lurker13]

...I'd draw them into a movie theatre and make them watch the Sex and the City Movie. :lol:

Thats going to far!

[Gummerfan]

Going to Walmart during a panic is a bad idea:
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2008/11/28/211518.aspx
Let's look at the Zombie numbers. The earth's population is approximately 6.2 billion. If we want to be SUPER optimistic, suppose only 20% of the population is infected and it stops there. (yeah, super-optimistic!). Thats just over 1 billion zeds, or, roughly the ENTIRE population of China.
Just imagine for moment what a nightmare trying to exterminate every single, solitary man, woman and child in China would present. Weapons of mass destruction have little success against zeds. There's no option of a truce, negotiation, or surrender by either side. Over 1 BILLION zeds would have to have their brains destroyed and the bodies incinerated.
Trying to exterminate the equivalent of every Chinese citizen? As we say in The South, "That's a tough row to hoe."
Of course, according to the movies, the number of infected outnumbers the uninfected, so that "20%" is really just a spit in the ocean. Think 55-90% or more.
Factor in the spread of the virus, the general disarray in which the world's military and governmental structure would find itself, not to mention the plight and problems of the majority of the survivors (finding food, avoiding infection, dealing with the elements, rioting, looters, criminals...).
Face it, we're boned.:lol:

[Lurker13]

Luckily the zombies don't think n we do! Once the first panic passed any survivors would be able to start working on killing zombies in there own areas. Survivors would be spread all over the country just lkie the zombies. a group of suvivors wouldn't have to kill a billion zombies. Just the ones around them. Then set up defenses against new ones. If zombies eat people wouldnt a lot of zombies be missing arms and legs from being eaten? lots of them would only able to crawl. And they couldn't think, so traps would be able to even the odds alot. Dont see why its not winnable.

[Bob]

Lets not forget about the large number that would be trapped in vehicles and indoors.

[Gummerfan]

It seems to be a popular opinion here that zombies don't get "hungry" and they don't go seeking out food. They stay exactly where they are unless something grabs their attention through sight, sound, or smell.
I'm not trying to start anything, but where did this idea originate? In all the Romero movies (and remakes), as well as TZSG, zombies roam.(the only exception is LOTD, but that takes place years after Z-day, and the zombies have wiped out the town, so there's nothing left to eat).
Zombies' only instinct is to eat, so it only makes sense that they'll roam around in search of food. This doesn't require thought or reason on their part. Even single-celled organisms move about in search of food.

[Lurker13]

I'm not trying to start anything, but where did this idea originate? In all the Romero movies (and remakes), as well as TZSG, zombies roam.(the only exception is LOTD, but that takes place years after Z-day, and the zombies have wiped out the town, so there's nothing left to eat).
Zombies' only instinct is to eat, so it only makes sense that they'll roam around in search of food. This doesn't require thought or reason on their part. Even single-celled organisms move about in search of food.

He doesnt mean zombies who CHOOSE to stay on the 5th floor of an office building. he means zombies who ARE STUCK on the 5th floor of a building cuz there to stupid to open doors or use an elvator. Or zombies that die in there cars and are still buckled in. Theyd be stuck where thy were.

[Gummerfan]

I wasn't referring to the post about trapped zombies, it's just that I've seen others here opine that zombies hang around their "old turf", rather than roam across the landscape in search of food. (as depicted in the movies as well as TZSG and WWZ).

[Bob]

Weapons of mass destruction have little success against zeds.

How are bombs, artillery, random high explosives and nuclear strikes not effective?

Now if you had specified NBC with the N a being radiological dispersal device (RDD) then I MIGHT partially agree.

But face it a zombie will vaporize just like a living being.
Extreme heat and concussive damage destroy cells living or dead.

[Gummerfan]

How are bombs, artillery, random high explosives and nuclear strikes not effective?

Now if you had specified NBC with the N a being radiological dispersal device (RDD) then I MIGHT partially agree.

But face it a zombie will vaporize just like a living being.
Extreme heat and concussive damage destroy cells living or dead.
Their effectiveness is limited to just that. Only the zombies within range of the blast will be vaporized. Zeds don't get radiation poisoning, they don't say "Oh crap! That's devastating! We'd better surrender now!".
By "little success" I mean that they'd be nowhere near as effective as they are on a human enemy. Not to mention the newly-created problem of radioactive zeds.
The A-bombs ended WW2 because they were so horrible they intimidated the Japanese into surrendering.(zombies don't surrender). The reason WMDs in terrorist hands is so frightening is the damage they would cause when used against other people and the terror and disruption such an attack would inflict.
There's no "known" biological agent that would work on zombies. And a chemical weapon would again be limited to whatever actual physical damage it could inflict.
Zombies got no psychology, they can't be frightened or intimidated.

[Lurker13]

Nukes really arent a good zombie weapon. Sure you could kill thousands or even a million with a blast but the damage to people and the ligering effects of fallout make it a bad idea. It would be nice to have glowing zombies though so we could see em in the dark! LOL! I also dont think setting a city on fire would be very doable. What does it take to burn a city like new york to the ground. Metal and concrete dont really burn and big citys are made of them. Besides i hate to waste all that realestate! And think of the guns and ammo in new york. Gotta be alot!

[Bob]

I did not mention surrender.
I was not referring to the psychological aspects.

Look up NBC and reread what I wrote.

While radiation would not have the effect on dead tissue it has on living it might hasten breakdown or it might sterilize it. That is why I mentioned RDD.

Some meats are irradiated to kill bacteria.
So radiation might actually cause a zed to have a slower rate of necrosis.

If the irradiation is at a high enough level the water in the cell would react and split possibly causing cell rupture. This should reduce a zed to a pile of goo and bones.

A nuke is a nuke is a nuke.
Radioactive dust in the wind is the same whether it was living or dead when reduced to ash.

[mattifikation]

Does radiation kill viruses? Because if so, radiation would stop a virus-caused zombie outbreak.

[Bob]

Radiation can kill viruses however Viruses border the line between living and not. It's an open debate whether they are "alive" or not and hence whether or not they can be killed. Viruses are non-living obligate parasites - they require a host to replicate their genetic material. The virus capsid (basic shape) is just designed to inject the genetic material into a host cell where it is copied hundreds/thousands of times before the host cell bursts releasing the newly created virus particles. As with all genetic materials, they can be damaged by free radicals, heat and ionizing radiation, but the damage to the host would be far worse, as our DNA and hence RNA strands are far more complex than a virus and would outweigh the benefit of having damaged the virus to a point where it can no longer replicate.

Radiation therapy at a level sufficient to kill a virus would destroy the surrounding cells but since the cells are already dead...
I would think it would require quite a bit of radiation to bring down a zed.

I wonder what the range of zed death from a spent nuclear fuel melt down would be?

[mattifikation]

I'm not sure. Even if it would take a lot, it's not like nuclear weapons are known for "low levels" of radiation. Supposedly, the fallout from a nuclear weapon has a low enough half-life that it's safe for humans to return topside after about 2 weeks underground.

As humans, we'd be smart enough to seek shelter. As zombies, they would walk around letting the radioactive rain land right on their heads.

[Ash in Housewares]

I'm not sure. Even if it would take a lot, it's not like nuclear weapons are known for "low levels" of radiation. Supposedly, the fallout from a nuclear weapon has a low enough half-life that it's safe for humans to return topside after about 2 weeks underground.

As humans, we'd be smart enough to seek shelter. As zombies, they would walk around letting the radioactive rain land right on their heads.

..or then they would mutate and then we'd have to deal super-mutant zombies!

always think the worst possible thing that could happen first..

[Subgenius]

If I recall correctly, in Day By Day Armageddon, it's suggested that use of nukes against cities infested with zombies would destroy many of them, but those that did not get destroyed in the blast, fire, and shock waves would be purified of any bacteria or insects that would eat away or cause rotting in the zombies. It would make them last longer. But, who really knows, right?

[mattifikation]

..or then they would mutate and then we'd have to deal super-mutant zombies!

always think the worst possible thing that could happen first..

One thing radiation doesn't do, is anything that Marvel Comics claims it does. :-p

[homelitexl]

yeah plus the radiation would kill us all.

[Bob]

While mutation would be a factor I think the mutations would be a failure for the most part, thats the way it works.

If there was a high enough concentration of zed in a specific place like in Mumbai it might be worth the fallout risk. Millions of Zeds in one strike.

[Lurker13]

As much fun as a snow plow would be, I personially would love to get my hands on one of them Aardvark mine clearing tanks that have been on futureweapons and such.

200 ton tank with a 20 foot wide spindle of 30 pound hammers on chains, flail
's spinning at high rates of speed normally used to destroy land mines, just picture what that would do to the zeds.

Oh ya, it's armored too.

If it comes with a desent stereo ill take 2 of em!

[Lurker13]

One thing radiation doesn't do, is anything that Marvel Comics claims it does. :-p

Be fair if we have zombies we could talk about mutant zombies to. But id rather not. Bob and someone else talked of nukes causing zombies not to rot and to last longer. How long would a zombie last normally and with nukes? Bodies rot pretty fast but how bout zombies? If they dont last long it would make it easy but they prolly do which would suck.

[Subgenius]

Be fair if we have zombies we could talk about mutant zombies to. But id rather not. Bob and someone else talked of nukes causing zombies not to rot and to last longer. How long would a zombie last normally and with nukes? Bodies rot pretty fast but how bout zombies? If they dont last long it would make it easy but they prolly do which would suck.

"Decomposition begins at the moment of death, caused by two factors: autolysis, the breaking down of tissues by the body's own internal chemicals and enzymes, and the process of putrefaction, the breakdown of tissues by bacteria."

If radiation sterilized the bacteria that cause putrefaction, as well as killing off all the insects that attack dead bodies, then the process of rotting known as decomposition will be halted or slowed down incredibly. We have not established that the autolysis of a human body is halted or not by the process of zombification. In some fictional zombies, both of these process of decomposition could be halted or reversed in the zombie by whatever it is that reanimated the zombies (act of God or by infection).

[Bob]

Something occurs to me.
If zombies were not decaying either because they just don't or due to radiation would they not become prey for predators?

Wolves have preyed on man since time immemorial it's not much of a stretch to imagine zombies becoming prey for feral dogs and other wild animals.

They are typically slow moving and would be easy to bring down compared to a moose.

[Gummerfan]

In TZSG Brooks says that scavengers avoid zombie flesh. Some kind of instinct.
This makes it convenient for moviemakers since they don't have to pay buzzard, coyote, or fly wranglers. :lol:

[homelitexl]

i say we go old school and napalm the hell out of them.

[Subgenius]

TZSG is a satire, so it's hard to use as a serious basis. But, on this issue, Brooks seems to be on to a good point. Whatever reanimated the zombies could be something that animals smell. That might cause them to avoid corpses that reanimated. But, I kind of like the idea of nature attacking the abominations that are zombies by using carrion eating animals to feast on them. It would lend hope to the idea that people could survive and outlast the zombie invasion(s).

Napalm is a weapon that could be used against zombies to great affect, but it's hard to control and could kill survivors as well. I like the idea of squads of troops armed with flamethrowers purifying city streets in a much more controlled method. We saw a glimpse of that in 28 Weeks Later. The problem is that the units would need to be closer to the zombie hordes. Then again, flamethrower tanks and flamethrower boats have been in use for about 50+ years by the US and British militaries.

Flamethrower boats:

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r134/john-subgenius/flamethrower-boat.jpg

Flamethrower tanks:

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r134/john-subgenius/Flamethrowertank.jpg

I do, however, like the idea of using a school as a bunker to hide away from and use as a base of operations for fighting back.

[homelitexl]

napalm them then nuke the hell out of them repeat process until they die.

[Bob]

Give the zombies free coffee and when they ask for creamer give it to them...

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/yt-yRw4ZRqmxOc/mythbusters_creamer_cannon/

[homelitexl]

napalm them

[Militaris]

Why not concentrate the efforts on localized areas. Instead of focusing the cleansing effort on the mainland where hundred of million if not billions of zombies could be roaming. Concentrating on smaller offshore islands could result in the creation of fairly large zombie free areas.

Take the South Island of New Zealand, its about 3/4 the size of england ( admittedly Half the land is mountainous so useless) and is protected by deep ocean trenches and currents It only has a population of 800,000. Killing off 750,000 zombies would be much easier then attempting to reclaim a Continent with billions of dead.

Iceland is another possibility, and it is more easily accessible for survivors from Europe and the eastern parts of North America. It only has a population of 320,000 so could potentially be cleared. Maybe the climate would deal with 90% of the problem during the first winter?

or concentrate on the smaller islands of the Caribbean for Americans or the Mediterranean for Europeans. But these are not protected by ocean trenches.

[Bob]

Possibly, but you would need a vigilant patrol on the beaches 24/7.
They would walk up out of the ocean.

[Militaris]

There is a good chance they would never make it across the open ocean, in the depths the water pressure could crash them. Maybe if they swallow enough water they would equalize their bodies... The ones which wander off shore and remain in the shallows but decide to return to land would be a threat. They might even avoid entering deep water unless they are following a prey....

Constant patrols would be next to impossible on any reasonable sized islands, A few would also survive in wilderness areas and would be a threat when they find their way back to civilization.

Even in a cleared island survivors would have to live and sleep in fenced compounds and to travel in armed groups. But instead of being greeted with hundred of even thousands of zombies they probably would only encounter a few.

[Dave Of The Dead]

Why not concentrate the efforts on localized areas. Instead of focusing the cleansing effort on the mainland where hundred of million if not billions of zombies could be roaming. Concentrating on smaller offshore islands could result in the creation of fairly large zombie free areas.

Take the South Island of New Zealand, its about 3/4 the size of england ( admittedly Half the land is mountainous so useless) and is protected by deep ocean trenches and currents It only has a population of 800,000. Killing off 750,000 zombies would be much easier then attempting to reclaim a Continent with billions of dead.

Iceland is another possibility, and it is more easily accessible for survivors from Europe and the eastern parts of North America. It only has a population of 320,000 so could potentially be cleared. Maybe the climate would deal with 90% of the problem during the first winter?

or concentrate on the smaller islands of the Caribbean for Americans or the Mediterranean for Europeans. But these are not protected by ocean trenches.

I like it. The Forum can get together, find a few bi-planes and find ourselves an island to take over! I would think being sort of a pirate would also be good. Sail near the shore and raid small towns for supplies every once in a while. Or heck, even sail the Great Lakes so at least there will always be fresh-ish water.

[homelitexl]

i say we just nuke them all and hope it fries the zed ass's

[Militaris]

Hopefully a few ocean going ships would have survived the initial stages of infection and would have found ways to restock with supplies (The surviving navy of the world would have probably secured themselves small islands quite early on.) If communication is working a group of them could pick up other survivors and became a base of operations for the cleansing process.

[kiltedninja]

We could occupy Alcatraz.

There's sharks offshore, and Shark is tasty.

[homelitexl]

and many nukes will survive just nuke the major cities and you should kill the majority of the zeds.

[Dave Of The Dead]

and many nukes will survive just nuke the major cities and you should kill the majority of the zeds.

Yeah! And then we get to worry about radiation and nuclear winter! Not to mention a great deal of the living supplies will go straight down the toilet! It would have to take time and not to mention a lot of patience.

[homelitexl]

i figure by that point i will be out of chewing tobaco and beer so i wont care the radiation might just keep me from going insane to an extent or if it fries me youll know me ill be the mutant glowing in the corner with a whiskey bottle in his hand yelling at an imaginary lawn gnome named hovis.

[Chaos Nightbringer]

Let's see, fighting an opponent who does not sleep, does not tire, does not need resources at all, and has only one goal. yeah, great idea genius. Fool-headed notions like that will get you killed.

You want revenge? SURVIVE!!! THAT IS YOUR REVENGE! NEVER LET THOSE STIFFS EVER, EVER, EVER GET YOU, THAT IS YOUR REVENGE.

[homelitexl]

you realize that an atom bomb would be like frieing there undead butts with the sun.

[hotlead]

1- Volcanoes, canyons, etc.- you don't drive zombies anywhere, they follow you places, who wants to volunteer to lead the zombies over the edge of Mt. Visuvius ?

2- Nukes- been covered, bad idea.

3- WallyWorld, K-mart, etc.- see nukes above.

4- Those who want to hide and hope everything goes away because the zombies are too scary, or think it's useless to fight back- good luck, don't get in anyones way.

5- I like the idea of starting small also, and I came up with a lure and run tactic I think would work well.

I figure a six person team would be best and they should be organized like this, team leader with semi-auto, 2 DMs with scoped rifles and pistols, 2 with semi-auto rifles, and the asst. team leader with a shotgun and pistol. All rifles and DMRs would ideally be chambered for the same cartridge.

You can lure the Zs that aren't trapped in some way to come to your position and reduce them untill they are at a certain distance, then displace to another position. The team leader is next to the DMs spotting and maintaining situational and fire discipline while the DMs take Zs at max effective range, the two rifleman watch and secure the flanks, the asst. team leader watches the rear and is ready to take point when moving out.

The DMs work untill the Zs are at 50yds, and then the team leader gives the order to displace. The ATL takes point to the first pre-selected fall back position, followed by rifleman, DM, TL, DM, and then the second rifleman, the immediate area is cleared and the team assumes it's "D" formation and prepares for the Zs to advance to within range. This continues until the Zs are reduced, the team is at the min. ammo compliment, or the team leader decides things are out of hand.

With two teams, they can leap-frog, keeping the Zs under constant fire. Or find a good defensive position in an "L" shape and take small to medium sized groups of Zs. I should come up with more zombie tactics based on these six man fire teams, and teams in multiples of three.

Just something I thought up on the can, what do you guys think?

[homelitexl]

still say we nuke them.

[Militaris]

Been thinking about this topic, the time to take the fight to the Zed is at the start of any outbreak not at the end. Instead of running to safe houses we should be running to the front land to aid in reducing numbers.

That would give time for unarmed and unprepared people to get away and get prepared to face the walking dead. It does have a large degree of danger, but surviving in a world of the dead is also dangerous.

For every person who does not escape would result in one more Zed to worry about.

[Subgenius]

"Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."

[Bob]

As I have said many times, the primary problem with early out break is ____
Who remembers????
I know someone does.

[homelitexl]

"Nuke em from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."

thats a great idea lets go with that everybody

[mattifikation]

Ok. We could nuke the zombies from orbit. Here's a problem though... when you come back down, the entire planet is going to be radioactive, poisonous, and barren. Not only will there be nuclear fallout to contend with, but also the food will be gone - all of it. In addition, every single factory, plant, waste facility, and storage facility that used to be loaded up with every type of poisonous and radioactive materials will have been blown wide open.

So what's your plan after "nuke them from orbit?"

Just stay in orbit until you run out of supplies and starve to death up there?

[homelitexl]

move to the moon and grow my own food and shoot them space squirels that probe rednecks.

[mattifikation]

There's no air on the moon. You can't grow things there.

[homelitexl]

live in one of those mone base things that have everything you need and shoot space squirells and moon men of my land.

[Slayer]

Nukes would be dropped on the cities, perhaps only the large cities, killing the majority of the zombies. Supplies would be raided from smaller cities and towns and the countryside, fallout would decay in 2-6 weeks to safe levels in area's far outside the blast zones. Though it would be unsafe to enter nuked area's for perhaps decades, and entering some area's in the long term safely would require gas masks, NBC suits, and time limits for being in the areas. Utilizing the nukes would drastically reduce the zombie population in the short term, it shares it's up's and downs, but overall, I think it is a workable solution if done correctly.

[Darkness]

"The Radioactive Cloud won't rise above a certain elevation. There are many mountain tops, and higher terrains, that would not be effected."

[mattifikation]

If there are such elevations, they are way above the frost lines and nothing grows there now. Add nuclear winter to the fact, and you've got a frozen waste land. I doubt it matters though: If a mountain top has snow on it, it's susceptible to fallout.

[kiltedninja]

as i have said many times, the primary problem with early out break is ____
who remembers????
I know someone does.

stupid people!!!!

[mattifikation]

stupid people!!!!

Hi there. You rang?

[homelitexl]

yep only you would would reply to that i still say we nuke them.

[Gentech Oasis]

Im not certain we have the capacity to handle something like that were it to really happen. With that said, I'd try to get to a really low population area and clear it of the dead with hopes that they wouldnt return. Then I'd get to FARMING!!!!!:)

[Bob]

Farming?
OK you can provide the corn for the still I am going to run.
I am sure we can work out some sort of trade.

[homelitexl]

and i can deliver the moonshine to mass awaiting public in my tank of a truck.

[The Patron]

i can not believe u guys are all this stupid. did u forget that nukelear radiation is one of the CAUSES FOR ZOMBIES???

[homelitexl]

yeah but the burns and blast will destroy the zombies and there won't be any corpses in the area for years until the radiotion has left.

[mattifikation]

i can not believe u guys are all this stupid. did u forget that nukelear radiation is one of the CAUSES FOR ZOMBIES???

No it isn't.

5 Scientific Reasons a Zombie Apocalypse Could Actually Happen (http://www.cracked.com/article_15643_5-scientific-reasons-zombie-apocalypse-could-actually-happen.html)

[homelitexl]

matt you have a point its only on the original night of the living dead that the radiation is the cause plus radiation burns would cause there flesh to burn off.

[Birdman44]

yeah, i dont think nuclear radiation will turn you into a zed, just kill ya :lol:

[NotoriousDIT]

i can not believe u guys are all this stupid. did u forget that nukelear radiation is one of the CAUSES FOR ZOMBIES???

what zombies?

[gama169]

Step one, gather mor weapons and supplies. Also rescue any survuvors foound along the way.
Step two: Leave 1/2 of able group to find supplies. Take the other able 1/2 to find surivors.
Step three: refortify my command base.
Step four: Kill any zombies near base.
Step Five: get more supplies and weapons.
Step six:Sweep out nearest town and kill all zombies outside buildings.
Step seven:More supplies again.
Step eight:Sweep out houses one by one every day by daylight until town has been thouroghly cleaned.
Step Nine: Gather remaining supplies and survivors, being careful incase there's a lone zed somewhere. Yay! The towns cleaned!:clap:
Step ten: Burn all zombie bodies in town.
Step eleven Barricade the town and make as many farms as can with seeds for food (supplies won't last forever. So got to start making own supplies) and get power back on (for the lights).
Step 12: Repeat steps six through elevn until all towns in state are clean.
Step thirteen:A distance from a city, shoot all Zeds we see.
Step fourteen: After entry is cleared, Send in battle group to clear out streets in the city keeping a group todefend the escape route at all times.
Step fifteen:Obviously it's impossible to kill all zeds in a city in the first sweep. So after forced to flee, repeat steps thirteen and fourteen till streets cleared.
Step 16: Sweep down buildings one by one keeping chekpoints to defend the building's entrance, the citie's entrance, and the path in between. step
17: Collect supplies in city.
Step 18: Make a thourough search to make sure city is clean.
Step 19: Barricade city heavily (as it is large).
Step 20: Make farms (Not able to make many in a city, but every bit of food counts. You know, for winter).
Step 21: Get power Back on.
Step 22: Make city livable (for resent rescued survivors.)
Step 23:Start training untrained survivors in the city leaving a minumum amount of able bodied people as instructers to train on guns, weapons, the body, etc.
Step 24: Repeat steps 12 through 23 with th other cities in the state.
Step 25: Clear out all non urban areas in state (Got to keep things safe)
Step 26: Get key radio towers back up.
Step 27: Communicate with nearby states to determine situation.
Step 28: Depending on situation, send a certain amount of people with supplies to kill zeds in nearby states. Make sure you send a little bit more than over kill though, as zombies ar extremely dangerous and can catch you in a trap (Unintentional, but yes, a trap) that may leave the group stranded in the city or twon till either A) the zeds are all killed. or 2) They're rescued. Or now that I think bout it 3) They die. So make sure you keep a long distance radio on them for communication. It may very well save their lifes.
Step 28 (oops): Repeat steps 6 through 26.
Step 29: Repeat steps 27 through 28 to create a fan spreadof city cleaning until the whole U.S. is clean.
Step 30:The U.S. is now clean, but the other Countires might need help. So get any way you can to communicate with another country.
Step 31: Talk to them using communications and any translaters you can find to learn their situation.
Step 32: Come up with conditions to team up with any country that's clean and can fight.
Step 33: Keeping enough men in the U.S. to defend it, send able bodied men to the country that's in the best condition (That still has a huge zed problem) that's still close (as not to waste supplies) in ships to help them.
Step 34: Repeat step 6 through step 29 (Except that there won't be any states).
Step 35: Repeat steps 30 through 34 until the world is clean. But this plan, as cautious as it is, would take years to complete. And there might be problems. Like maybe the first over seas group won't end up in a very good position. In this case, always make sure there is enough supplies and weapons with them to get there, get back and establish several command bases. As the hardest part, if you can even get to it would be getting to the other countries to help them. After all, what if there isn't any place that they can dock to to the dock not existing, or being to congested with zeds to safely enter. You always have to be able to give your men the return option with town plundering. And that is my long plan for a campaign against the zombies.

Edit:Thanks for telling me how tomake it more presentable.

[NotoriousDIT]

Worst post in the history of posts omg

[gama169]

R-Really? 1 h4t3 y0ui

[mattifikation]

What's happening here is the epic failure that ensues when the wealthiest nation in history spends more money on bank bailouts than education.

[Dave Of The Dead]

Yay History Channel for teaching me what all my other teachers didn't!
Yay alcohol and drugs for making all that knowledge disappear!

[Bob]

Gama169

It actually was not bad.
There weren't all that many misspellings.
The problem is you need to learn where the enter key is.

You actually wrote that much like I would have.
Most of the time I use short statements like you did.
The style works great when you have a lot to say.

The trick is not run them together.
When they run together you get a mess.
Separating the statements makes it easier to read.

I even agreed with some of what you said.
But I didn't read any of it the first couple of times I caught up on this thread.
The way the text looked, never mind what it said, was off putting.
After you got slammed I decided to wade through the morass.

Don't feel bad my posts tend to be long and therefore ignored.
Remember for the average person "wurds are hard"

You know I must be sick.
I am being way to nice to people.
I think I need to go to the doctor.
Maybe what I need is concussive noise therapy.
I am going to the range at lunchtime today, that usually makes me feel better.

[Subgenius]

I agree, Bob. Gama could have easily just made that post into a list. It was numbered like a list. Also, it's funny that people on the Internet hate reading, when most all of the Internet is about reading. Sure, there are videos and pictures, but MOST of what we do is reading words. And, it is a shame how badly people write, spell, and use poor grammar. I especially hate that Leet Speak BS and texting in places that do not need it. Texting is for cell phones.

Anyway, Gama, you did have some good ideas. You just needed to perfect your presentation in order to get people interested enough to read through it all. If I were you, I would just edit that post and make it into a proper list.

[kiltedninja]

The list was actually great, though I have a few questions. How likely is it that we'd find someone with the knowledge and training to run a power plant?

That leads to a few other parts of your list, but your systematic idea of taking cities is a great thing.

[gama169]

Yes, I admit that the whole power thing would be a problem. That's based on luck of the draw, I guess. If you can't get full power back, then the best I could say is to get power generaters hooked up to key buildings.

[Militaris]

The list was actually great, though I have a few questions. How likely is it that we'd find someone with the knowledge and training to run a power plant?

That leads to a few other parts of your list, but your systematic idea of taking cities is a great thing.

Power stations are often areas of high security, protected by solid wire fences and are often remote. Anyone working in the Power Station during the initial outbreak would be relatively safe until they run out of food.

[homelitexl]

you forget give me all the coors beer and the how to run a powrplnt for dumbasses book and ill run it and take your coors beer as my pay

[kiltedninja]

That's cool, since I don't like Coors, I'll give you all I find.

[homelitexl]

okay thats wierd how can you not like coors, but who cares it means you wont drink it more for me that way and i volutennerr to find a way to get the railroads running again.

[DeAdLY SiNZz]

give me about 30 men/women, 4 hummvees with the gun ontop thank goodnes im in the military got access to this stuff :evil: anyway 2 APC's, 10 dirtbikes/crotch rockets and a semitruck modified like the one off the movie death race, then about 100 guns of various types and i'm good to go, it's time to go zombie hunting boys yeeeeehaaaaw (rockem sockem robots) it fit 4 some reason.

[homelitexl]

give me 100 coors a week 5 guys and each have a ar-10, a tommy gun and a shotgun and we could do the same thing

[kiltedninja]

I don't like coors because I'm a fan of beer not piss in a can.

Give me my best friend, and give us M14s, and we'll get things done.

[DeAdLY SiNZz]

give me 100 coors a week 5 guys and each have a ar-10, a tommy gun and a shotgun and we could do the same thing

i like to be more prepared and have a good offense combined with a good defense incase something goes to hell. why take any chances losing any good people when you can have some protection as well as fighting capaabilty. :x

[homelitexl]

well coors isn't piss in a can anyway all i need is a good fort and alot of ammo in a 308. caliber and a gun cleaning kit, and a lot of food water and beer.

[DeAdLY SiNZz]

hell if we want to get technical give me some 7mag hunting rifles and a M40a3 rifles couple thousand rounds and some men/women and we will jsut start sniping them all

[homelitexl]

the 308. is better

[UseYourHeadAndYourMachtte]

arm yourself with a rocket launcher, a shitload of ammo, 2 machine gun emplacement and a mile radias of explosives around your hideout and wait for u 2 b surrounded and then blow those mo-fos straight back 2 hell:shock:

[kiltedninja]

Can+Piss= Coor's. The math says it all.

Like I said, just arm me and my best friend with whatever weapons we need, and give us enough time, and we'll get it done.

[Dave Of The Dead]

A gallon of vodka, a 10x10x15ft cage bolted to the ground in the middle of a parking lot and a good pump shotgun.:drinking: I'll get it done. For the motherland! Ukrainian power! :drinking:

.....:puke:

[Zombie opressor]

ok guys read the zombie survival guide......................... ok now that ur done look at on they attack and living in an undead world and combine the two by waiting 20 years after the intialy attack, expand ur territory and take out any zombies around ur hideout. and slowly go on from there. and as for weapon machete,shaloin spade, crowbar,katana are all good and ur group should each have one or more and for primary weapon go with a m1 carbine with a silencer, do not use fire unless u A. don't want anything from the place u might burn B u know u can control it from spreading towards u or ur hideout( don't think about using it against zombies around ur hide out then ur defense will be up in flames and C it is ur last option as for spreaders i like motalov coctails, the classic greek technic of liting a trail of gasolin right when zombies come near it, and something as simple as throwing a torch into a crowd of zombies

[Bob]

What kind of Vodka?
Some of it is fit only to use as rubbing alcohol.

What you really need is dehydrated alcohol.

[kiltedninja]

ok guys read the zombie survival guide......................... ok now that ur done look at on they attack and living in an undead world and combine the two by waiting 20 years after the intialy attack, expand ur territory and take out any zombies around ur hideout. and slowly go on from there. and as for weapon machete,shaloin spade, crowbar,katana are all good and ur group should each have one or more and for primary weapon go with a m1 carbine with a silencer, do not use fire unless u A. don't want anything from the place u might burn B u know u can control it from spreading towards u or ur hideout( don't think about using it against zombies around ur hide out then ur defense will be up in flames and C it is ur last option as for spreaders i like motalov coctails, the classic greek technic of liting a trail of gasolin right when zombies come near it, and something as simple as throwing a torch into a crowd of zombies

oh man, you're serious aren't you? Do you have ANY of that stuff you just stated?
Second, have you ever hit someone in the head with a crowbar? It takes a lot of strength to crack the skull.
Third, have you ever been outnumbered in a fistfight? It's tough.
Fourth, a silencer doesn't make a gun silent, suppressor is the appropriate word for it.
Fifth, I'd much rather drink the vodka, unless it was crap vodka, then it'd just be used to make torches.
Sixth, firing one shot is not going to immediately draw five thousand zombies to your location, there's effective ways of evasion, you're not limited to a single route.
And last, what's worse than a zombie everyone? A FLAMING ZOMBIE! Did you read the zombie survival guide?

Now, back to my normal post, Any sort of cage short of something made out of wrought iron bars or strips of the same would be useless against hundreds or thousands of Zack. Give me my Lee Enfield, a tall structure, several thousand rounds, several gallons of Mtn. Dew, some jerky, sunflower seeds, a sleeping bag and a tarp and I'm set.

[homelitexl]

dude all i need is a fort my truck, my woman, my guns my sword, and a bunch of coors

[Bob]

I must be slipping.
I thought he was going to drink the Vodka...

[Birdman44]

I like the way you think kiltedninja, just change that mtn. dew to pepsi and the sunflowers to pumkin seeds and you got it right! :lol:

[Birdman44]

Oh and I need a machete or hatchet. Sorry for double post.

[Dave Of The Dead]

Hell yeah I'm going to drink the vodka! Smirinoff by the way. No way am I wasting good boose on making fire. Its there just to keep me entertained.

By the way, most of us have red the Zombie Survival Guid and most of us have slowly over time debunked most of the crap in that book. You'll learn that that book is nothing but a conversation starter if you hang around here long enough.

[the_velociraptor]

Actually, I recommend being sober. Among the chance something bad is going to happen and you'll need a weapon in a pinch, there's also the fact you'll do something probably dumb.

Or get addicted.

[Faran Brigo]

Well, it's good to see people managed to stay on topic while I was gone :P

I just read a book on small unit infantry tactics. Maybe by the end of the week I'll have something entertaining and productive.

[Bob]

Well it is Smirnoff then all it is fit for is making Molotov Cocktails.
I can't believe people actually drink that and popov and some of the others.
You should try Russian Standard or at least Stolichnaya the difference between that and Smirnoff is like night and day.

Russian Standard mixes well and it's also good as shots.
Chill the bottle then two ounce shots.
I am not much for sipping it straight, that's what Wild Turkey is for.

http://www.russianstandardvodka.com

Oh uhh save the drinking for when you are in a secure location or don't drink more than a couple of ounces at a time otherwise you will become lunch for Zack.

[kiltedninja]

Stolichnaya is my friend, but of course I'd only drink in a safe place.
I prefer whisky, that's more my thing, but I'd take some Stoli.

Anyway, when it comes to 'taking the fight to Zack' it's a matter or walking into the cities that you escaped in the first place. I'd find a secure location, somewhere at the top of a hill preferably, a secure location with lots of space.

After that, I'd go down the hill and start clearing buildings with a shotgun, pistol or carbine, depending on what I could find.

By the way, when I say 'I', I mean my team and I, I couldn't possibly hope to clear even a small town(Which is where I'd start) by myself.

[homelitexl]

well id go gor a brick building with bars on the windows and a steel door.

[Bob]

Russian Standard is better than Stoli.
Wild Turkey is sipping whiskey at 101 proof you better sip it.

[kiltedninja]

I'll have to try some Russian Standard sometime.

I hate smirnoff though, it's like drinking hairspray, just not as sticky.

[DarthJoe8]

Well, it's good to see people managed to stay on topic while I was gone :P

I just read a book on small unit infantry tactics. Maybe by the end of the week I'll have something entertaining and productive.

:clap:Welcome back, you've been missed!! :drinking:

[Dave Of The Dead]

I've only tried the expensive shit once, but that was too long ago for me to remember. Really, I would only drink if entertainment were in short supply. When taking the fight to the zed, I would absolutely start in the suburbs and go house to house. You can always find good stuff in a middle-class neighborhood.

[Bob]

Most younger people only drink for effect, lord knows I did.
I drank everything from "shine" to champagne.
I liked the shine better than the champagne though.
I really never cared much for wine, probably caused by drinking a half a gallon and puking my guts out. Now a days I drink so little I only drink good stuff, unless it's provided by someone else in which case it is only polite not to talk smack about their cheap liquor.

What thread is this again?
Oh yea, I still think improvised explosives on a RC car would be a good way to clear a number of them at once.

[homelitexl]

dude i came up wth that idea 6 months ago.

[kiltedninja]

Most younger people only drink for effect, lord knows I did.
I drank everything from "shine" to champagne.
I liked the shine better than the champagne though.
I really never cared much for wine, probably caused by drinking a half a gallon and puking my guts out. Now a days I drink so little I only drink good stuff, unless it's provided by someone else in which case it is only polite not to talk smack about their cheap liquor.

What thread is this again?
Oh yea, I still think improvised explosives on a RC car would be a good way to clear a number of them at once.

I must be one of the strange young people then, since I don't like getting totally hammered. The police don't like violent drunk minors.

I've got a better idea. You rig a shopping cart so it can only go straight, fill it up with ANFO(Ammonium Nitrate+ Diesel Fuel) and this part takes a little practice; You get a huge horde of zombies to follow you to the bottom of a hill, run up the hill while someone is waiting with the shopping cart and a molotov cocktail, they push the cart, and throw the molotov cocktail at it. BOOM, big explosion.

[Bob]

Homelite

Yes I remember it was your idea.
I was reiterating that I thought it was a good idea.

[homelitexl]

im impressed anyone thought it was a good idea but i tink it would work better with a rc plane

[Bob]

I think a car or truck would carry a heavier payload.

[kiltedninja]

Fact is, RC something and explosives=something like a good idea.

The papers they use for cigarettes now goes out if you're not smoking them, so we can't use the old dynamite with a cigarette on the end trick anymore.

But I would so do that if we could.

[Dave Of The Dead]

Fact is, RC something and explosives=something like a good idea.

The papers they use for cigarettes now goes out if you're not smoking them, so we can't use the old dynamite with a cigarette on the end trick anymore.

But I would so do that if we could.

The cheap ass cigs still burn to the filter.

[Tomeh]

Armored trucks, if we ever go down bust out with shotguns and cause hell.

[ZombieGore]

there is no way im reading through every post to see if someone has brought this up yet..so forgive me...lol

I feel like barbed wire would be a great item to have plenty of in your "safe house"... If you could string up lots of barbed wire around a perimeter not only would it keep them from you but zed could easily become entagled in it... what do you call 50 zombies that cant move? target practice... or you could just torch the bastards...

[mattifikation]

your idea - barbed wire + razor wire = improved idea

[weirdenator]

your idea - barbed wire + razor wire = improved idea

???:drool:whats the difference:drool:???

[Bob]

Maybe you know it as concertina wire.

[ZombieGore]

your idea - barbed wire + razor wire = improved idea

I had actually thought of that...I just wasn't sure which one would work better...

[CAVU45]

there is no way im reading through every post to see if someone has brought this up yet..so forgive me...lol

I feel like barbed wire would be a great item to have plenty of in your "safe house"... If you could string up lots of barbed wire around a perimeter not only would it keep them from you but zed could easily become entagled in it... what do you call 50 zombies that cant move? target practice... or you could just torch the bastards...

Barbed wire is way outdated. No one gets tangled in it anyway. Concertina on the other hand is an entirley different thing. It was made to tangle and cut people. Once you get it in your skin it isn't easy to get out. Barbed wire will stab or scratch you. Concertina will hook you like a fish and when you do pull it out, it leaves a very nasty cut behind.

[ZombieGore]

Oh wow...ya you guys are right for sure...I just looked at pics of both of them...that razor wire is some hardcore stuff...in my head barbedwire looked alot gnarlier lol...

[CAVU45]

No worries. I have up close and personal experience with that stuff, having been tangled in it before. I still have the scars on my legs. An old friend ran into a triple strand. It took two hours to get him out of it and close to a hundred stitches to close up all the cuts. There was no easy way to get him out. We basically grabbed it and started ripping it out of his flesh. There was simply no other way to do it.

[JimiVengeance]

if i was alone id probably just kill myself...no reason to live all alone...if i still had my group with me i would build up some defense...barriers walls...just secure a large enough area to live safely:drinking:

[unnamedbaby77]

if i was alone id probably just kill myself...no reason to live all alone...if i still had my group with me i would build up some defense...barriers walls...just secure a large enough area to live safely:drinking:

wow sounds like you got this SURVIVAL thing a bit backwards

I believe its NEVER stop fighting instead of kill myself cuz I am lonely

I have been wrong before though

[ZombieGore]

wow sounds like you got this SURVIVAL thing a bit backwards

I believe its NEVER stop fighting instead of kill myself cuz I am lonely

I have been wrong before though

Jimi is into death and all things dark...lol...and I dont think he will be coming back to ATZ anytime soon...the US&D guys scared him off...

[mattifikation]

:cry:

:lol: